If you aren't ranked internally first but you get the highest raw HSC mark, will you be scaled less than the person in first? (2 Viewers)

[jimmysmith560]

Essentially, with first and last ranks, the Assessment Mark is made identical to the Examination Mark. For example, if a student was ranked first, and the highest Examination Mark for a subject that this student took was 90, that student will receive 90 as their Assessment Mark. Similarly, if a student was ranked last, and the lowest Examination Mark for a subject that this student took was 50, that student will receive 50 as their Assessment Mark. This process, however, is not exactly the same with other ranks, such as 3rd. Consider the following example from NESA:

As you can see, the highest Assessment Mark was adjusted to equal the highest Examination Mark (92). The lowest Assessment Mark was also adjusted to equal the lowest Examination Mark (50). However, the Assessment Mark for the student ranked 3rd is not identical to the third highest Examination Mark.

 

[Hiheyhello]

but then isn't that unfair?

because say a person gets like an 80 in their internal mark (averaged) and is rank 20 --> and this lower mark is because they were marked harsher internally. But then the same person gets the top mark of 95 in the hsc.
so wouldn't the internal mark be increased to align with the hsc mark in order to account for the internal marking bias?

their hsc mark of 95 would still attribute to half of their atar (the externals component)

and it’s not unfair because for their internals, they won’t get ‘80’, they’ll take the hsc mark of whoever came third in their cohort (not directly tho as jimmy smith said, it’ll be similar but not exactly). and if the teacher was marking rlly hard, then whoever comes third in externals is gonna get a mark that’s wayyy higher than 80

 

[specificagent1]

Essentially, with first and last ranks, the Assessment Mark is made identical to the Examination Mark. For example, if a student was ranked first, and the highest Examination Mark for a subject that this student took was 90, that student will receive 90 as their Assessment Mark. Similarly, if a student was ranked last, and the lowest Examination Mark for a subject that this student took was 50, that student will receive 50 as their Assessment Mark. This process, however, is not exactly the same with other ranks, such as 3rd. Consider the following example from NESA:

As you can see, the highest Assessment Mark was adjusted to equal the highest Examination Mark (92). The lowest Assessment Mark was also adjusted to equal the lowest Examination Mark (50). However, the Assessment Mark for the student ranked 3rd is not identical to the third highest Examination Mark.

Yes but it continues to be in respect to your rank. Essentially they do some wack stuff to keep the average the same and interpolate your mark to keep spread and all the same. It's wack

 

[jimmysmith560]

Yes but it continues to be in respect to your rank. Essentially they do some wack stuff to keep the average the same and interpolate your mark to keep spread and all the same. It's wack

Absolutely, ranks remain a key element. It's just that Assessment Marks aren't adjusted to specifically equal Examination Marks except with the highest and lowest marks.

 

[ExtremelyBoredUser]

Got it, I'll top english so I don't have to worry about this. Time to get back to essays.

 

[zizi2003_]

However, the Assessment Mark for the student ranked 3rd is not identical to the third highest Examination Mark.

yeah, that's what I thought.

it'd be incredibly unfair to give someone who came third (and got an 80 internally) a 70 (a mark someone else got in the hsc and ranked third accordingly)

 

[Life'sHard]

Essentially, with first and last ranks, the Assessment Mark is made identical to the Examination Mark. For example, if a student was ranked first, and the highest Examination Mark for a subject that this student took was 90, that student will receive 90 as their Assessment Mark. Similarly, if a student was ranked last, and the lowest Examination Mark for a subject that this student took was 50, that student will receive 50 as their Assessment Mark. This process, however, is not exactly the same with other ranks, such as 3rd. Consider the following example from NESA:

As you can see, the highest Assessment Mark was adjusted to equal the highest Examination Mark (92). The lowest Assessment Mark was also adjusted to equal the lowest Examination Mark (50). However, the Assessment Mark for the student ranked 3rd is not identical to the third highest Examination Mark.

My god have I seen this table over a billion times HAHAHAHA

 

[quickoats]

TLDR you don’t really “swap” ranks, rather, NESA take the top and bottom external HSC marks and use their algorithm to fit everyone in between, accounting for the relative spaces. Moderation is about the fairest system you can get.

 

[Life'sHard]

TLDR you don’t really “swap” ranks, rather, NESA take the top and bottom external HSC marks and use their algorithm to fit everyone in between, accounting for the relative spaces. Moderation is about the fairest system you can get.

I’m assuming outlier scores remain an outlier?

 

[quickoats]

I’m assuming outlier scores remain an outlier?

I’m sure they take care of outliers relative to in school performance.

 

[Hiheyhello]

TLDR you don’t really “swap” ranks, rather, NESA take the top and bottom external HSC marks and use their algorithm to fit everyone in between, accounting for the relative spaces. Moderation is about the fairest system you can get.

and does moderation account for the dispersion of clusters?

 

[quickoats]

and does moderation account for the dispersion of clusters?

Yes - thats why they try to maintain the relative spaces between students.

 

[iwanttodogoodinschool]

Hey! So for internals, my final rank is first for a few subjects. Although I'm completely losing motivation to study for HSC. I've heard that whoever is first internally is given whatever the highest external mark is for that subject in your school. Is this true? Oh god, I hope so.

 

[jimmysmith560]

Hey! So for internals, my final rank is first for a few subjects. Although I'm completely losing motivation to study for HSC. I've heard that whoever is first internally is given whatever the highest external mark is for that subject in your school. Is this true? Oh god, I hope so.

Being ranked first as your final rank means that your Assessment Mark will be adjusted to equal the highest Examination Mark of any student in your cohort. This is subject to the moderation process. Your Examination Mark is determined by your own performance in the HSC exams for your respective subjects, and is not affected by your ranks relative to your cohort or your school rank.

 

[iwanttodogoodinschool]

Being ranked first as your final rank means that your Assessment Mark will be adjusted to equal the highest Examination Mark of any student in your cohort. This is subject to the moderation process. Your Examination Mark is determined by your own performance in the HSC exams for your respective subjects, and is not affected by your ranks relative to your cohort or your school rank.

So whatever I get in the HSC will be my own mark and not the top person's mark?

 

[jimmysmith560]

So whatever I get in the HSC will be my own mark and not the top person's mark?

That is correct. Top ranks will be beneficial with respect to the Assessment Mark, not the Examination Mark.

 

[iwanttodogoodinschool]

That is correct. Top ranks will be beneficial with respect to the Assessment Mark, not the Examination Mark.

Well I'm screwed ahahhaha.
Thanks for the info!

 

[jimmysmith560]

Well I'm screwed ahahhaha.
Thanks for the info!

No problem! Don't lose motivation! You have achieved great things up to this point and if anything, this demonstrates a strong and determined mindset. I'm sure you will be able to build on your already amazing ranks by performing well in the HSC exams!

 

[sammantha]

If I have an average of 30% in Advanced maths and my rank is relatively low (80 out of 100 students) but I do really well in the HSC, would I be able to achieve a band 4 in maths?

nup, it's aligned with respect to ranks only. the fairness is questionable certainly

 

[Life'sHard]

If I have an average of 30% in Advanced maths and my rank is relatively low (80 out of 100 students) but I do really well in the HSC, would I be able to achieve a band 4 in maths?

It depends how well those ranked in the 80’s perform in the HSC. If your internal mark is 30 and external mark is 100. You get an average of 65 which is band 3. However if your peers in the 80s range improve and everyone in that rank of 80 get their average mark up to 50% for example you included, your estimated internal mark could be 50 and external would be 100. Averaging 75 which is band 4. Jimmy can double check if what I’m saying is total garbage lol.