'Make Poverty History' (2 Viewers)

[paper cup]

Yes I have seen the live 8 thread.

I just want to ask the question, do any of you think it's possible to 'make poverty history' like they've got all the celebs to tout?

Africa is so far behind economically - one smh article reckons that it'll take over a hundred years for it to solve the very basic problems.

orgasm noises, but realised that own imitation of that noise is not only ridiculously bad..." says:
isn't that terrible?
neo says:
no, i think that it's funny. it's an exercise in PR.
neo says:
african children are starving. african children probably don't even know wtf live 8 is (except perhaps in egypt and south africa), african children will starve with or without live 8

Maybe I'm just like this total wuss but it feels so terrible, I can't find any word to describe it other than terrible. And nothing really can be done, even if the G8 countries can be pressured into abolishing debt and giving more aid the corruption and so on means Africa will still go around and around in circles of famine and civil war and AIDS and everything fucked that can possibly happen.

Your opinion?

Oh wait I got to paste a link otherwise my thread's going to get deleted by McLake.

http://smh.com.au/news/world/blair-...e-us-on-warming/2005/07/01/1119724811747.html

 

[...]

nope...

even though they can do it, but i fail to see why they would..i mean if they are willing to erase all teh debt and double the aid, they wouldn't have done it cos of some concerts...

i guess its all politics...its like asking why Bush attacked Iraq instead of donating the money spend on the war to aid these african countries...

 

[Rafy]

Before we start throwing money at Africa, we have to take into account the widespread corruption in many african nations. Many are involved in civil wars, and simply throwing money at the problem while going some way to alleviate problems i think will have little impact. In the past many leaders have diverted funds to finance wars, or their own extravagant lifestyles at the expense of the people.

 

[neo o]

Yes I have seen the live 8 thread.

I just want to ask the question, do any of you think it's possible to 'make poverty history' like they've got all the celebs to tout?

Africa is so far behind economically - one smh article reckons that it'll take over a hundred years for it to solve the very basic problems.

orgasm noises, but realised that own imitation of that noise is not only ridiculously bad..." says:
isn't that terrible?
neo says:
no, i think that it's funny. it's an exercise in PR.
neo says:
african children are starving. african children probably don't even know wtf live 8 is (except perhaps in egypt and south africa), african children will starve with or without live 8

Maybe I'm just like this total wuss but it feels so terrible, I can't find any word to describe it other than terrible. And nothing really can be done, even if the G8 countries can be pressured into abolishing debt and giving more aid the corruption and so on means Africa will still go around and around in circles of famine and civil war and AIDS and everything fucked that can possibly happen.

Your opinion?

Oh wait I got to paste a link otherwise my thread's going to get deleted by McLake.

http://smh.com.au/news/world/blair-...e-us-on-warming/2005/07/01/1119724811747.html

One link, coming up http://smh.com.au/news/world/africas-dark-heart/2005/07/01/1119724811773.html

1) Aid - Entrenches despots, is squandered by corrupt governments.
2) Aids Medication - Doesn't reduce the prevalence of AIDS, it increases it.
3) Lowering or removal of agricultural trade barriers - Assuming that African governments don't invest in technology, would lead to massive environmental harm from large scale agriculture (and any debate on this is academic anyway since French and American farmers love being payed to grow nothing, and these barriers won't be lowered in the near future).

The article says it all IMO, The only way to ensure economic development and an improvement in the living standards of Africans is through democracy.

 

[malkin86]

Before we start throwing money at Africa, we have to take into account the widespread corruption in many african nations. Many are involved in civil wars, and simply throwing money at the problem while going some way to alleviate problems i think will have little impact. In the past many leaders have diverted funds to finance wars, or their own extravagant lifestyles at the expense of the people.

Or developed govts have just given african govts guns, or tanks or non-useful things, (water-driven power plants to landlocked countries I seem to recall) so that it seems like they just want to have African nations in their hold - saying 'you owe us money for that hare-brained scheme we convinced you to buy into'.

 

[tWiStEdD]

cherryblossum: he's right... it's an exercise in PR at best though there are some excellent ideas at the heart of it all the only problem is they're just jumping ahead by a few too many years.

... (if that is really your name!): G8 will never abolish debt and they won't do it for all the right reasons. The economic, social and resulting moral ramifications of such a decision would be disastrous; to decide in the affirmative would be morally repugnant. A basic understanding of economics would help you understand why.

neo_o: yes.

malkin_86: perhaps, but there are greater issues than these. It's also more than likely that these 'sales' are ficticious posterchildren for the left or for anti-government forces.

 

[SashatheMan]

Yes I have seen the live 8 thread.

I just want to ask the question, do any of you think it's possible to 'make poverty history' like they've got all the celebs to tout?

Africa is so far behind economically - one smh article reckons that it'll take over a hundred years for it to solve the very basic problems.

orgasm noises, but realised that own imitation of that noise is not only ridiculously bad..." says:
isn't that terrible?
neo says:
no, i think that it's funny. it's an exercise in PR.
neo says:
african children are starving. african children probably don't even know wtf live 8 is (except perhaps in egypt and south africa), african children will starve with or without live 8

Maybe I'm just like this total wuss but it feels so terrible, I can't find any word to describe it other than terrible. And nothing really can be done, even if the G8 countries can be pressured into abolishing debt and giving more aid the corruption and so on means Africa will still go around and around in circles of famine and civil war and AIDS and everything fucked that can possibly happen.

Your opinion?

Oh wait I got to paste a link otherwise my thread's going to get deleted by McLake.

http://smh.com.au/news/world/blair-...e-us-on-warming/2005/07/01/1119724811747.html

so true i think mods get rep points for deleting or sometihnfg, they love to do it

 

[paper cup]

cherryblossum: he's right... it's an exercise in PR at best though there are some excellent ideas at the heart of it all the only problem is they're just jumping ahead by a few too many years.

... (if that is really your name!): G8 will never abolish debt and they won't do it for all the right reasons. The economic, social and resulting moral ramifications of such a decision would be disastrous; to decide in the affirmative would be morally repugnant. A basic understanding of economics would help you understand why.

neo_o: yes.

malkin_86: perhaps, but there are greater issues than these. It's also more than likely that these 'sales' are ficticious posterchildren for the left or for anti-government forces.

cherryblossom has an o in it.

 

[go_swans]

as long as Robert Mugabe... (or however its spelt) is in control of Zimbabwe it will be fucked.

 

[HotShot]

hmmm.. poverty is something, but maintain human health is different. if all the countries forgot about putting into defense and invested in Africa, the people of africa will be healthy and fit. pverty always exists but that is not the concern for africa they dont have the necessities first and tats wat they need.

so as i send invest in Africa and it will pay off in the future and it wont take 100 years if they start now, they could finish by the end of the year if the effort is put in, bt as usual the americans dont realise this that human life is being wasted and their could brillaint geniouses natural talent in the african world, but well thats how the world is.

 

[katie_tully]

Meanwhile 30% of Australians live below the poverty line ...

 

[neo o]

Meanwhile 30% of Australians live below the poverty line ...

30%? Regardless it's relative not absolute poverty.

 

[IceBreaker]

no it won't work, there's just too much corruption in the african government.

 

[persephone]

I think it's great to want to rid Africa of poverty. But I'm much more worried about poverty in Australia. I don't know if the Live 8 stuff will work. Poverty is a huge problem worldwide. Concerts and singers won't solve it.

 

[azzie]

I think it's great to want to rid Africa of poverty. But I'm much more worried about poverty in Australia. I don't know if the Live 8 stuff will work. Poverty is a huge problem worldwide. Concerts and singers won't solve it.

the point of live 8 is to raise awareness- "we dont want your money, we want your voice"
there will always be some level of poverty in every nation but what exists in the third world is so far beyond what can be considered normal that it makes me feel sick. while ending this debt may solve short term economic problems, institutions and structures must be put into place not only through the IMF for WB but the government itself to make tough long term economic change to make sure there is economic growth and development, as well as TRUELY developing the principles of free trade and nieche markets rather than low value-added commodities such as agricultural goods. it is also crucial for the involvement of NGOs to be continued and heightened to raise the living standards and opportunities of education, health care etc to the lower strata of the economy in such a way that while harsh government reform is being carried out to benifit the nation in the long term, those living in critical conditions may recieve aid and support to get themselves on their feet too.
thus money is important, but how it is used is even more crucial.

 

[funniboi]

china's paid off some of africa's debt to other countries, i guess it is possible to 'make poverty history'

http://www.smh.com.au/news/World/China-writes-off-debt-from-Africa/2005/07/07/1120704495154.html

 

[paper cup]

Meanwhile 30% of Australians live below the poverty line ...

you'll find that the Australians in 'poverty' are much better off than the people in 'poverty' in Africa. and we have social welfare and our government permits drunks to wander around not making any attempt to get employment and whining about how little money they're scabbing off taxpayers. It doesn't work that way my friend.

 

[Generator]

Some people make it sound as though the lifestyle of an unemployed person, an addict or a homeless person is nothing more than a tax-payer funded holiday.

 

[paper cup]

Some people make it sound as though the lifestyle of an unemployed person, an addict or a homeless person is nothing more than a tax-payer funded holiday.

*rolls eyes*
some people have no appreciation of the difference between first world and developing world definitions of key words, such as

'poverty'
and
'democracy'

stop being didactic generator.

 

[Generator]

Even though the definitions (I would say measurements) differ, that doesn't mean that the poverty in Australia is of no consequence or that the idea of what you call 'democracy' is justified merely because a nation-state is seeking economic development (normally at the expense of social and environmental conditions).

As for the point that I raised in my previous post, it was just a general observation that i was likely to raise at some stage.