What does feminism mean to you? (2 Viewers)

[zstar]

whiney lesbians who couldn't keep a stable relationship.

 

[*TRUE*]

Man rapes woman: its a horrendous crime and the perpetrator is sent to prison for years

woman rapes man: its was just a bit of a joke lol. cleared of all charges

Oh God, that made me angry.

 

[Smile_Time351]

not just women, but both genders. males are discriminated against also, everyone deserves a level playing field.

Not to be overly prejudicial, your post does please me, it's nice to see a female anti-feminist, but on average, us males have it pretty good, unless you're Lily Allen or Pink.

I do think however that this highlights effectively what most people think of feminism::rofl::rofl::rofl:

 

[russs]

Man rapes woman: its a horrendous crime and the perpetrator is sent to prison for years

woman rapes man: its was just a bit of a joke lol. cleared of all charges

That story is disturbing, but I can't help but laugh.

 

[Uncle]

Man rapes woman: its a horrendous crime and the perpetrator is sent to prison for years

woman rapes man: its was just a bit of a joke lol. cleared of all charges

LOL

trannies should follow suit.

 

[Rasengan2dabalz]

Man rapes woman: its a horrendous crime and the perpetrator is sent to prison for years

woman rapes man: its was just a bit of a joke lol. cleared of all charges

uno that case has probably paved a whole pathway for other cases similar to this ie - where a female penetrates a male against there wishes.
This is just fucking bullshit, because i can imagine pretty well that if it was a male stripper penetrating a woman with a dildo at a hens night that he would get time in jail.

 

[AlleyCat]

i am a moderate difference feminist.
people might not want to categorise themselves as femisists per se, but i think if you asked a bunch of questions on gender equality to the population, most of them would show feminist sympathies imho.

 

[Ben1220]

I think the big problem for Feminism is the big loud radicals who always make a lot of noise, and create an illusion that most feminists are stupid narrow people who actually support going directly against the original aims of feminism for equality between the sexes. Most intelligent people would agree that it matters not what sex someone is but what they do with their life and the choices they make, you can't choose your gender.

Often the noisy radical feminists do more harm then good for the cause of the majority of intelligent feminists, in two ways, first of all through the actual policies they support, such as forcing companies to hire a certain percentage of women, even if only a very small number of women apply. This clearly reduces the quality of the workers, as employees must choose employers based on their gender as opposed to their actual abilities. It also obviously goes directly against the uncontroversial statemant I layed out before, that we should be gender neutral when gender is not a concern, as it is almost always not a concern for how suitible a person would be for a job.


Second of all they create an image of feminism that causes many people to reject it as the ravings of angry psychopaths, which is not the case for the majority of intelligent feminists.

I'm not denying that sexism exists, but many feminists ignore the full picture, that sexism goes both ways, in fact some of the proponents of feminism even support this sexism. Instead of making petty childish groups and playing "battle of the sexes" trying to make laws favour one sex over the other, we should recognise that sexism can only be partially solved through the legal system, and is only partially a legal problem. The best thing to do is scrap the laws that apply to gender when it is irrelevant, of course this doesn't include maternal leave, because that actually is relevant, but all the "affirmative action" crap is doing more harm then good. Any sexism that remains after the law is actually not sexist anymore will be a cultural problem, and should be addressed through education and inspiring films. This remaining cultural sexism could go both ways as well. Think of "women and children first", "ladies first" and the political incorrectness of making jokes about women.

Also the claim that employers would be biased against women if it weren't for affirmative action is impossible to prove, probably untrue and does nothing but cause more confict. People do not like being falsely accused. Any employer who was stupid enough to not hire an intelligent competant women due to her sex probably won't last long anyway.

I do realise that most feminists actually do believe in equality between the sexes and aren't like this, just the noisy stupid minority, but that minority is allowed to get away with spewing out all kinds of garbage and hate in the name of feminism, ruining its credability.

/rant

 

[SylviaB]

In theory: Equal rights for females.

In practice: Blatant double standards and finger-pointing at males.

 

[Serius]

maternal leave, because that actually is relevant

This is the only thing i strongly disagree with. Why exactly cant we have paternal leave like they do in Europe? having a baby is just as trying and mentally difficult for males, its a hard time full of ups and downs and instability, and if a male feels he needs to take time off to sort out his family and whats going on, he should be allowed that.

Apart from that i think that feminism is fundamentally flawed, even right from the start they are called "feminists" as if they support female rights rather than equality. If they were truly about equality they would change their name to something gender neutral like "equalists" [that sounds gay but its the best i can come up with]. Even when they approach equality issues, they always do it from the perspective of the female gender, and they ONLY address issues of injustice that females face...how is that fair?

If i were to make an equal rights movement i wouldnt call it something stupid like masculism, it would be called something that represents equality for both genders and i think it would have strong support, both from males who feel that their legal rights are being undermined, and disenfranchised feminists who feel their organisation has gone too far[i.e many of the feminists in this thread]. I also think its something the public and females in general who arent feminists would feel more inclined to get behind, after all i think most people support equal rights, but feminists are seen as scary and weird by the public.

 

[lilika01]

* Curves (woman-only gym)

Because women are frequently harrased in cogender gyms. And can I just mention gentlemen's clubs? Clubs where women are excluded; and it's not for any kind of safety or protection reasons. It's because men want to exclude women, plain and simple.

* Extra provisions for single moms

While there should be equal provisions for single fathers, noone can deny the fact that there are far more single mums than single dads. Plus the whole glass ceiling, being paid less thing is also a major factor.

* "Women in business" networks, "women in business" awards, women in business bla bla bla

glass ceiling, being paid less than men, harder to get jobs in some industries if a female than a man etc.

* Extreme double standards when it comes to sexism, physical abuse etc

again, happens waaaay more often to women. And like someone said just before, in the few instances where it's the other way round, it's only because of the mysoginistic steryotype of women being weak and pathetic. Is it too much to say that some men bring it on themselves? A little karma perhaps?

* Fat is beautiful (I am not sure who's fault this is exactly).

Uuumm.... nothing to do with feminism or women's rights? Men get fat too. I'm not sure who's fault this is either. Genes? McDonalds? hmmmm...

 

[Rasengan2dabalz]

glass ceiling, being paid less than men, harder to get jobs in some industries if a female than a man etc.

Yeah thats true. On average men get payed more the women do - but have you noticed alot of high paying careers are only being studied by men despite the all the encouragement the indurstries are providing for women. For example, the computer industry is booming at the moment and will continue to rise, however hardly any women go into computer courses, not because females arent allowed to follow that career, simply because they just dont study that course.

 

[lilika01]

Yeah thats true. On average men get payed more the women do - but have you noticed alot of high paying careers are only being studied by men despite the all the encouragement the indurstries are providing for women. For example, the computer industry is booming at the moment and will continue to rise, however hardly any women go into computer courses, not because females arent allowed to follow that career, simply because they just dont study that course.

That's a valid point, but just because women are 'encouraged' to go into a certain field, doesnt mean they're really encouraged. Things like IT and the military are really still male dominated fields, and despite a veneer of sexual equality, in IT a man is still more likely to be hired than a woman, and in the army (or even worse, the navy) women are constantly sexually harassed, and in some cases raped by fellow crewmembers.

 

[*TRUE*]

Yes I am a feminist.

You're definitely correct that discussions of feminism are usually muddied by the existence of a variety of competing strands that are often not compatible with one another. It might be a good idea to very briefly give an overview of some of the types of feminism roving around the acadmeic world:

-Liberal Feminism: Essentially involves an extension of liberal political theory to women - revolves around equal rights, freedom of choice and formal equality in regards to legislation.
-Radical Feminism: Much emphasis placed upon relations of sexual violence between men and women, particularly involved in the critique of pornography. This is the Germaine Greer style of feminism often brought up within the public sphere.
-Socialist Feminism: Examines interactions between gendered and economic inequalities. Interested in the differential division of household work, labour market income inequality and the way women and men tend to occupy different sectors within the employment market. Not particularly associated with Marxism.
-Difference Feminism: Broadly speaking, this position suggests that there are fundamental differences between women and men. Purusing gender "equality" is not taken to mean making men and women the same, but rather catering for their different needs and values.
-Postmodern Feminism: This paradigm questions the categories of male and female, and seeks to undermine the notion that there is any unitary feminine subject. Very difficult to explain in two sentences.

I don't have perfect clarity in my own mind about where I stand in regards to this issue.
Liberal feminist - I think so
Difference feminist - yes, mildly so.
Socialist feminism - I'm curious.
I've felt more troubled by discrimination experienced by men lately, tbh.

 

[Rasengan2dabalz]

That's a valid point, but just because women are 'encouraged' to go into a certain field, doesnt mean they're really encouraged. Things like IT and the military are really still male dominated fields, and despite a veneer of sexual equality, in IT a man is still more likely to be hired than a woman, and in the army (or even worse, the navy) women are constantly sexually harassed, and in some cases raped by fellow crewmembers.

Im sorry but i have to disagree, females are really being encouraged into IT. Yes its male dominated but jobs arent handed out to males rather that females.

 

[lilika01]

Im sorry but i have to disagree, females are really being encouraged into IT. Yes its male dominated but jobs arent handed out to males rather that females.

I have never heard any of this encouragement, to be honest. There is a lot of fake encouragement towards women in many areas, but when it comes down to it, women in these kind of courses are considered a joke. And whether their male counterparts intend it or not, they certainly don't take the women in their industry seriously compared to themselves.
But that's not always their fault; sexism and gender steryotyping begin in the home and from childhood, so many men, expecially in fields where it is not usual to find a women, simply don't take women seriously.

 

[loquasagacious]

I have never heard any of this encouragement, to be honest. There is a lot of fake encouragement towards women in many areas, but when it comes down to it, women in these kind of courses are considered a joke. And whether their male counterparts intend it or not, they certainly don't take the women in their industry seriously compared to themselves.
But that's not always their fault; sexism and gender steryotyping begin in the home and from childhood, so many men, expecially in fields where it is not usual to find a women, simply don't take women seriously.

I've worked in a professional context with many 'women in IT', working in both the private and public sector. I've come across women in every type of role (BA, PM, tester, coder, etc). Women have also been surprisingly well represented in my uni IT courses. One of my close female friends is an engineer and my sister is studying engineering.

On the whole I haven't found them to be discriminated against because of their gender and they certainly haven't told me that they felt discriminated against. In fact the slightly funny thing which a couple of them have mentioned is the dating upsides of being women in a male dominated field.

 

[russs]

Because women are frequently harrased in cogender gyms. And can I just mention gentlemen's clubs? Clubs where women are excluded; and it's not for any kind of safety or protection reasons. It's because men want to exclude women, plain and simple.

I've been attended a gym for the last 1 1/2 years and I don't see women being 'harassed' in there. Gentleman's clubs do not exist today - they are not allowed by law. Curves, Fernwood etc are all allowed to exist.

I am sure if I open a male-only gym tomorrow, I will be on Today Tonight in a couple of days. The female-only gyms are a double standard and there is no argument there.

While there should be equal provisions for single fathers, noone can deny the fact that there are far more single mums than single dads. Plus the whole glass ceiling, being paid less thing is also a major factor.

First, the mother will almost always get custody of the children. She will fight for the custody and then expect the society to pay for her mistakes.

'Single moms' are understandable if they are a widowers or such. If you can't afford to have children - don't have them.

glass ceiling, being paid less than men, harder to get jobs in some industries if a female than a man etc.

Don't complain about the glass ceiling effect. I've met successful women in business who are very effective. But you do not take into account that most women in business will prefer to deal with other women in business (they will almost always pick a female supplier over a male, a female customer representative over a male). This effect is at large in the business community - and women further distance themselves further by isolating themselves through "women with attitude networks" etc. Women expect to be able to discriminate men, but they also expect men to give them the upper hand.

The fact is, if you are a woman in business both men AND women will pay more attention to you - you will have a far more easier time to get to the top.

If you are wondering why there are so few female IT managers, you should maybe attend an IT lecture at a university. The female:male ratio in there is roughly 0:100. If females stick to subjects such Arts, what do you expect? On the other hand, if there was a 1:1 ratio in an IT degree and 80% of the workforce were male, there would be some discrimination evident.

again, happens waaaay more often to women. And like someone said just before, in the few instances where it's the other way round, it's only because of the mysoginistic steryotype of women being weak and pathetic. Is it too much to say that some men bring it on themselves? A little karma perhaps?

Pick the right men and it won't happen to you.

Uuumm.... nothing to do with feminism or women's rights? Men get fat too. I'm not sure who's fault this is either. Genes? McDonalds? hmmmm...

I am talking about the "fat is beautiful" discussions you often see on TV, where for some reason a profound feminist decides that 'men should accept women for who they are' and a long discussion about chauvinism and how 'all men are pigs' begins.

Guys like slim women with nice personality.
Girls like tall guys with flash cars and lots of money.

Guys will pick the most attractive woman with the best hip-waist ratio.
Girls will pick the most powerful, most dominant male.

You don't fit the criteria? Then work on yourself and fix it, don't complain about it. Don't blame others for your problems and remember that you can't change the human nature.

 

[glowstick]

Feminism = the reason for high male unemployment, dirty houses, dirty clothes etc. = BAD idea

 

[LMSKACS]

i do not consider myself sexist, i strongly believe in equal rights, and yet i believe that men and women are different, stemming right from our Neanderthal times. We developed differently, and appropriately are suited to different jobs and tasks.
that doesn't mean that are women is subjected straight to the kitchen per se, men can be capable in the kitchen as well. but some people are more suited to professions then others.
e.g. The amount a man gets payed is higher then in comparision to women, but this is due to Men being more physically competitive, and that isnt sexist but evolution. people pay more for someone working at a better rate, thats fact.
i think some people need to be a bit more realistic about feminism in general and ease off a bit, society has gone a bit loco in my opinion. sure then can be absolute wanks out there (men AND women) but thats equality right?
If two people of equal abilities, equal personalities and with the only segregation between them being gender, cant get the same job for the same pay then yes thats a problem.
but sometimes a women's dominance in the workplace can lead to a lack of promotion, it just needs to be made clear that they are there to do their job, they are there because of their ability and no other reason. this will remove any desire to prove themselves due to a lack of fellow females and to just concentrate on the job.