Abortion (2 Viewers)

[Absolutezero]

If both the man and the woman involved disagree adamantly and persistently on whether the woman should have an abortion, who gets the final say? If both forces are equal, who wins? Or who should win?

What if the woman decides to go through with the birth, and the man simply doesn't have the financial or emotional level necessary to support it? Should the father have no say at all in what happens to the baby? If he doesn't, why then must he have responsibility for it?

 

[Lentern]

i remember reading this a while ago and i guess i got the impression that you believed it. reading back, you were only explaining the reasoning behind the conclusion that was not yours.

i am so sorry lentern, have an abortion, its on me

also i still stand by the point that a woman is not the only one that goes through a "physical and hormonal roller-coaster" so this is a useless criterion.

I think any survey you might find will suggest the impact it has on the woman tends to infinitely greater.

 

[funkshen]

I think any survey you might find will suggest the impact it has on the woman tends to infinitely greater.

lol, changing the goalposts. now it's not that she suffers, its that she suffers the most. this is an absurd claim seeing as though you can't measure suffering, through a survey no less. i would argue that a man suffers infinitely more because he has to put up with a temperamental and incapacitated bloated woman for nine months (or rather, the rest of his life) and i have the surveys to prove it. i just think the idea that a man has no reproductive rights is ridiculous.

 

[Annihilist]

What if the woman decides to go through with the birth, and the man simply doesn't have the financial or emotional level necessary to support it? Should the father have no say at all in what happens to the baby? If he doesn't, why then must he have responsibility for it?

Exactly. While he shouldn't necessarily get the final word on what happens to the baby, I don't think he should be obliged to support or take responsibility for it if he didn't want it.

 

[Lentern]

lol, changing the goalposts. now it's not that she suffers, its that she suffers the most. this is an absurd claim seeing as though you can't measure suffering, through a survey no less. i would argue that a man suffers infinitely more because he has to put up with a temperamental and incapacitated bloated woman for nine months (or rather, the rest of his life) and i have the surveys to prove it. i just think the idea that a man has no reproductive rights is ridiculous.

He has the right to wear a condom.

 

[Galapagos]

also i still stand by the point that a woman is not the only one that goes through a "physical and hormonal roller-coaster" so this is a useless criterion.

lol, changing the goalposts. now it's not that she suffers, its that she suffers the most. this is an absurd claim seeing as though you can't measure suffering, through a survey no less. i would argue that a man suffers infinitely more because he has to put up with a temperamental and incapacitated bloated woman for nine months (or rather, the rest of his life) and i have the surveys to prove it. i just think the idea that a man has no reproductive rights is ridiculous.

This is utterly ridiculous. A man doesn't have to push a fucking watermelon-sized alien out of his reproductive orifice. Indeed in most cases the most they have to do is watch it come out.

Nobody is changing the goal posts: a man is obviously impacted by a pregnancy, but like I said, no watermelons.

 

[mirakon]

This is utterly ridiculous. A man doesn't have to push a fucking watermelon-sized alien out of his reproductive orifice. Indeed in most cases the most they have to do is watch it come out.

Nobody is changing the goal posts: a man is obviously impacted by a pregnancy, but like I said, no watermelons.

You are completely ignoring the fact that a man feels enormous emotional and mental strain the entire time too. Considering that a baby is pretty much produced from a sperm and an egg, there is no reason why a man's say should be completely neglected.

 

[funkshen]

This is utterly ridiculous. A man doesn't have to push a fucking watermelon-sized alien out of his reproductive orifice. Indeed in most cases the most they have to do is watch it come out.

Nobody is changing the goal posts: a man is obviously impacted by a pregnancy, but like I said, no watermelons.

donny, you're out of your element

He has the right to wear a condom.

ok

 

[Lentern]

You are completely ignoring the fact that a man feels enormous emotional and mental strain the entire time too. Considering that a baby is pretty much produced from a sperm and an egg, there is no reason why a man's say should be completely neglected.

Ugh, men.

 

[funkshen]

i know right???

 

[Lentern]

It is such a reflection of the male oriented way in which society has been constructed that for the trouble of letting a little jiz out he suddenly accrues a raft of rights pertaining to the woman he had sex with. For you pigs the woman is just an object, a receptacle for the jiz, once his jiz is in her he suddenly has accrues property in her. She must consider the poor man's feelings when she decides what it is she wants to do with the body that used to... or perhaps you think it was never hers to begin with. Honestly the way Mirakon just framed it you might have thought pregnancy was a 50-50 process, parenting can be I'll grant you but pregnancy is 99% the woman and 1% the man. Any delusions the man might have about being more involved are socially or psychologically constructed and a pregnant woman has more than enough on her plate already, she shouldn't have to worry about accommodating the man's delusions of self importance.

 

[halapenyo]

It is such a reflection of the male oriented way in which society has been constructed that for the trouble of letting a little jiz out he suddenly accrues a raft of rights pertaining to the woman he had sex with. For you pigs the woman is just an object, a receptacle for the jiz, once his jiz is in her he suddenly has accrues property in her. She must consider the poor man's feelings when she decides what it is she wants to do with the body that used to... or perhaps you think it was never hers to begin with. Honestly the way Mirakon just framed it you might have thought pregnancy was a 50-50 process, parenting can be I'll grant you but pregnancy is 99% the woman and 1% the man. Any delusions the man might have about being more involved are socially or psychologically constructed and a pregnant woman has more than enough on her plate already, she shouldn't have to worry about accommodating the man's delusions of self importance.

you spelt jizz wrong.

 

[mirakon]

It is such a reflection of the male oriented way in which society has been constructed that for the trouble of letting a little jiz out he suddenly accrues a raft of rights pertaining to the woman he had sex with. For you pigs the woman is just an object, a receptacle for the jiz, once his jiz is in her he suddenly has accrues property in her. She must consider the poor man's feelings when she decides what it is she wants to do with the body that used to... or perhaps you think it was never hers to begin with. Honestly the way Mirakon just framed it you might have thought pregnancy was a 50-50 process, parenting can be I'll grant you but pregnancy is 99% the woman and 1% the man. Any delusions the man might have about being more involved are socially or psychologically constructed and a pregnant woman has more than enough on her plate already, she shouldn't have to worry about accommodating the man's delusions of self importance.

i do not understand how a man having a say into the future of something that can potentially be his child is in any way objectifying the woman. I never said that the woman shouldn't have a say, what I'm saying is you can't just discount everything the man has to say either.

 

[funkshen]

a man (?) whiteknighting about womens issues (and misrepresenting them)? how very feminist.

 

[Lentern]

i do not understand how a man having a say into the future of something that can potentially be his child is in any way objectifying the woman. I never said that the woman shouldn't have a say, what I'm saying is you can't just discount everything the man has to say either.

That is because you view it through the prism of a man setting out to to maximize his interests and after centuries of patriarchal social conditioning you are lead to believe that these interests should pretty much include all the earth and heaven too.

 

[funkshen]

i look at it the other way

a pregnant woman is holding a man's baby hostage

 

[Lentern]

i look at it the other way

a pregnant woman is holding a man's baby hostage

If you're not going to take this seriously I'll just go and watch Eurovision.

 

[Galapagos]

You are completely ignoring the fact that a man feels enormous emotional and mental strain the entire time too. Considering that a baby is pretty much produced from a sperm and an egg, there is no reason why a man's say should be completely neglected.

I didn't say that at all, but okay. In an ideal world a pregnant woman would consult the father (in the event he cares) and discuss the issue, like adults, and make logical, fair decisions.

I would suggest perhaps some sort of agreement must be signed by both parents before an abortion, but that would only work in an ideal world. Could you imagine the strife a woman/man would feel if the other party won't sign? What would happen then?

donny, you're out of your element

I don't appreciate patronization. Get over yourself.

 

[funkshen]

I don't appreciate patronization. Get over yourself.

go on.

 

[MrFox]

Why can't a man have a say in whether his child is born or not?

i believe a man can have a say but the choice is ultimately up to the woman. he should not force her to have the child or to abort it

i am pro choice