Discussion Thread for Atar Notes & other forums (2 Viewers)

[iStudent]

To be honest, I don't think mods are expected to answer HSC questions. At least back in 2014, queries were generally answered by the people in the same year, year above and the year above that and mods facilitate the discussion (by creating e.g. marathons) or regulating the discussion so it doesn't derail too much.

Perhaps your views have been affected by the role of mods in AN? (who I believe, have financial incentives to help - unlike here, where mods are completely selfless in answering questions and no one should be indignant that they are not helping even if they could).

Also, I don't think there is a responsibility for uni students to help out after they are done with BoS - uni is busy and people move on from high school. Would have thought the idea is that questions are asked and answered by Yr12s (since it helps them the most), as well as any other uni students who are kind enough to take time out of their schedule to help.

Also: you'll be surprised how much you forget after HSC. Myself included, I have generally forgot a significant portion of HSC content and to help answer questions would require me to flick out the textbook or my notes and relearn.

 

[donkily]

To be honest, I don't think mods are expected to answer HSC questions. At least back in 2014, queries were generally answered by the people in the same year, year above and the year above that and mods facilitate the discussion (by creating e.g. marathons) or regulating the discussion so it doesn't derail too much.

Perhaps your views have been affected by the role of mods in AN? (who I believe, have financial incentives to help - unlike here, where mods are completely selfless in answering questions and no one should be indignant that they are not helping even if they could).

Also, I don't think there is a responsibility for uni students to help out after they are done with BoS - uni is busy and people move on from high school. Would have thought the idea is that questions are asked and answered by Yr12s (since it helps them the most), as well as any other uni students who are kind enough to take time out of their schedule to help.

Also: you'll be surprised how much you forget after HSC. Myself included, I have generally forgot a significant portion of HSC content and to help answer questions would require me to flick out the textbook or my notes and relearn.

if you look at it now, not many uni students do seem to help out with the hsc questions

yeah kind of

i do agree but im sure they wouldve used this forum in high school for academic help and now that they went to uni they wouldnt seem to keen on helping people out (so they dont seem to keen on getting this forum moving). but not all years 12s would be way ahead in terms of content so they probably wouldnt be able to help if they were helping other students who are ahead in their learning

if the new syllabus came into effect, would it be worth learning new content in order to help out all the hsc students? (especially if you aren't doing the stuff at uni e.g. say you're doing Arts/Law at uni and you were interested in helping the HSC students with maths, would it be worth learning the new maths curriculum just to help out all the HSC students)

i seriously think bos has become dead and boring now. we need to somehow promote bos again so it becomes active again

 

[InteGrand]

seriously we need to start promoting bos again

idk how bos was so active in the past (i assume it's people helping each other and people joining to make the benefits out of it) but if it was the exact same as it was in the past (in terms of help), id reckon it would be as active today

but one rival site has taken a number of bos users

Why are so many BOS users seemingly transitioning to this "one rival site" (no prizes for guessing which site it is, I think)? Is it because they are finding they can't get their questions answered on BOS but can on the rival site?

 

[boredsatan]

Why are so many BOS users seemingly transitioning to this "one rival site" (no prizes for guessing which site it is, I think)? Is it because they are finding they can't get their questions answered on BOS but can on the rival site?

Is this rival site atar notes

 

[pikachu975]

Why are so many BOS users seemingly transitioning to this "one rival site" (no prizes for guessing which site it is, I think)? Is it because they are finding they can't get their questions answered on BOS but can on the rival site?

Free essay marking maybe because you need 15 posts there to get it

 

[Green Yoda]

Is this rival site atar notes

This kid defs deserves a prize

 

[boredsatan]

This kid defs deserves a prize

What are you talking about?

 

[donkily]

Free essay marking maybe because you need 15 posts there to get it

this is probably the biggest factor in my opinion

everyone wants free essay marking where they get detailed feedback, not the sort of feedback the teacher at your school gives you (and most essay markers whether b6 students or hsc markers would charge $20 per essay, i mean if someone wanted to write 100 essays for practice throughout the year look how much they need to fork from their parents pocket)

having 15 posts to get an essay marked makes the forum run hence they need that sort of thing to make their forum more active

i seriously think bos shoudve had an essay marking service years ago. ive come across old threads for people asking for feedback on their english stuff and if there was a thread for essay marking at a certain "post count cost" then probably people this forum would be more active

although a number of mods dont have the time to do this (due to uni and work commitments) i think it's best to get someone outside of bos to do this to get the community active again by essay marking

also a number of questions here are unanswered discouraging users to post, so they'd think it's best to go to another site and post there

i guess "free notes" and their "free lectures" also get more people on that site as opposed to here

 

[boredsatan]

This kid defs deserves a prize

What prize do you think I like?

 

[strawberrye]

this is probably the biggest factor in my opinion

everyone wants free essay marking where they get detailed feedback, not the sort of feedback the teacher at your school gives you (and most essay markers whether b6 students or hsc markers would charge $20 per essay, i mean if someone wanted to write 100 essays for practice throughout the year look how much they need to fork from their parents pocket)

having 15 posts to get an essay marked makes the forum run hence they need that sort of thing to make their forum more active

i seriously think bos shoudve had an essay marking service years ago. ive come across old threads for people asking for feedback on their english stuff and if there was a thread for essay marking at a certain "post count cost" then probably people this forum would be more active

although a number of mods dont have the time to do this (due to uni and work commitments) i think it's best to get someone outside of bos to do this to get the community active again by essay marking

also a number of questions here are unanswered discouraging users to post, so they'd think it's best to go to another site and post there

i guess "free notes" and their "free lectures" also get more people on that site as opposed to here

One mini point I want to make about this is firstly, it is not physically possible for someone to write 100 essays for practice (that's like 25 essays per module-which suggest they are either studying very inefficiently or don't know what they are doing), and equate to 2 essays for every single week of the year... which again suggest they are not studying efficiently and effectively. On a less literal interpretation, someone who writes that many essays will not be seeking an online tutor unless they have travel or other issues, and is most likely going to get an in person tutor, and also $2000 assuming $20 per essay equates to average cost of English tutoring over the same period anyways, so it is not that much of a difference. Lastly, although it could be great to have more generous people to do things for free, the reality is people need to survive and they need money to do that, and time becomes more valuable the less you have of it.

However, having said that, regardless of where BOS heads in the future, I definitely think your viewpoints and all these discussions of pros, cons and possibilities are productive in at least evaluating why BOS has changed to the way it is and maybe some ways to improve it for the better.

 

[boredsatan]

One mini point I want to make about this is firstly, it is not physically possible for someone to write 100 essays for practice (that's like 25 essays per module-which suggest they are either studying very inefficiently or don't know what they are doing), and equate to 2 essays for every single week of the year... which again suggest they are not studying efficiently and effectively. On a less literal interpretation, someone who writes that many essays will not be seeking an online tutor unless they have travel or other issues, and is most likely going to get an in person tutor, and also $2000 assuming $20 per essay equates to average cost of English tutoring over the same period anyways, so it is not that much of a difference. Lastly, although it could be great to have more generous people to do things for free, the reality is people need to survive and they need money to do that, and time becomes more valuable the less you have of it.

However, having said that, regardless of where BOS heads in the future, I definitely think your viewpoints and all these discussions of pros, cons and possibilities are productive in at least evaluating why BOS has changed to the way it is and maybe some ways to improve it for the better.

How many posts do you need to get an essay marked on BoS?

 

[strawberrye]

How many posts do you need to get an essay marked on BoS?

We don't have a policy regarding that, and anyways, a post count is arbitrary because arguably unfair if someone just spams forum with 'posts' and then be entitled to essay marking... but throwing aside concern of potential abuse of system, we simply don't have anyone that has time to do free essay marking in the mod-team unless a forum member volunteers to do this service.

 

[pikachu975]

How many posts do you need to get an essay marked on BoS?

This forum isn't a tutoring or essay marking centre it's for people doing HSC to talk/discuss their time at school and to seek peer help with homework and questions they might have. It also has countless resources and anyone can seek help here which I think is the main thing.

 

[donkily]

This forum isn't a tutoring or essay marking centre it's for people doing HSC to talk/discuss their time at school and to seek peer help with homework and questions they might have. It also has countless resources and anyone can seek help here which I think is the main thing.

essay marking isnt considered "tutoring" of some sort-it's more about helping others and giving them the best advice to get people in the right direction

i do not think atar notes has the right to say they are offering "free hsc tutoring" when in reality all their doing is offering free hsc help (through an online forum platform). there is a clear difference between tutoring someone and helping them (although tutoring does involve helping most of the time)

integrand doesn't offer "free hsc tutoring" on behalf of the bos community. he helps them. i also dont think your school teachers offer "free tutoring" to certain hsc students either

if AN can say they provide "free hsc tutoring" why cant BOS? they offer similar services to their users?

 

[donkily]

Lastly, although it could be great to have more generous people to do things for free, the reality is people need to survive and they need money to do that, and time becomes more valuable the less you have of it.

However, having said that, regardless of where BOS heads in the future, I definitely think your viewpoints and all these discussions of pros, cons and possibilities are productive in at least evaluating why BOS has changed to the way it is and maybe some ways to improve it for the better.

i do agree, people do not get employed for nothing in return (i forgot to mention but the mods on AN do this as part of their employment, they actually dont mark for free) but as i mentioned mods on bos do not do this as they are busy with work and uni commitments

that's why i personally think it's best to recruit someone outside of this forum to voluntarily mark essays for others (and it should be someone working full time because when you work full time, you are more inclined to think you are earning enough money that you wouldnt need to work another job for money) and this candidate should be one who is still inclined to the hsc and enjoys helping others (for nothing in return)

 

[pikachu975]

i do agree, people do not get employed for nothing in return (i forgot to mention but the mods on AN do this as part of their employment, they actually dont mark for free) but as i mentioned mods on bos do not do this as they are busy with work and uni commitments

that's why i personally think it's best to recruit someone outside of this forum to voluntarily mark essays for others (and it should be someone working full time because when you work full time, you are more inclined to think you are earning enough money that you wouldnt need to work another job for money) and this candidate should be one who is still inclined to the hsc and enjoys helping others (for nothing in return)

I don't think someone wants to work for 10 hours at a job then come home and mark like 5 essays for no price especially since they can take up to 30mins-1hour

 

[strawberrye]

i do agree, people do not get employed for nothing in return (i forgot to mention but the mods on AN do this as part of their employment, they actually dont mark for free) but as i mentioned mods on bos do not do this as they are busy with work and uni commitments

that's why i personally think it's best to recruit someone outside of this forum to voluntarily mark essays for others (and it should be someone working full time because when you work full time, you are more inclined to think you are earning enough money that you wouldnt need to work another job for money) and this candidate should be one who is still inclined to the hsc and enjoys helping others (for nothing in return)

Good luck in finding a person like that, let us know when you have found one and I am sure other forum members will be very grateful for their existence.

 

[iStudent]

Donkily, I think you're being a bit idealistic with your suggestions.

Sure, some people love to help - but even that comes with limits. Suggesting that people re-learn high school content that is completely useless to them - just for the sake of answering a few questions people MIGHT have, or having someone dedicate hours of their time marking essays for "free" is just unrealistic.

I understand your sentiment, but gotta be realistic, you know?

While having BoS active like it used to be is great and all, I feel like you have a misguided sense of entitlement - that HSC students deserve to have uni students who help the next cohort (for free). As it has been in the past, I feel like the onus is on the current Yr12s to make use of this site - to ask and answer their own questions - after all, this is a forum mostly for high schoolers not uni students!

 

[donkily]

Donkily, I think you're being a bit idealistic with your suggestions.

Sure, some people love to help - but even that comes with limits. Suggesting that people re-learn high school content that is completely useless to them - just for the sake of answering a few questions people MIGHT have, or having someone dedicate hours of their time marking essays for "free" is just unrealistic.

I understand your sentiment, but gotta be realistic, you know?

While having BoS active like it used to be is great and all, I feel like you have a misguided sense of entitlement - that HSC students deserve to have uni students who help the next cohort (for free). As it has been in the past, I feel like the onus is on the current Yr12s to make use of this site - to ask and answer their own questions - after all, this is a forum mostly for high schoolers not uni students!

Well there’s a purpose for me to be idealistic, I guess that’s to shed some perspective of this forum compared to AN

I never suggested that people relearn ‘useless’ high school content just to help HSC students, I just asked if it was a good idea/worth it but got no response

And I do not think every year 12 would want to get a response from another year 12-sometimes people might go out of the syllabus and not realise it (and ask for help with a not in school syllabus question) and someone that did the HSC not too long ago would get them back on track (well they could it better than a current HSC student) assuming they do not forget the content fully

I personally think that if bos had been sponsored with unis and various educational organisations, it would be much more active and more questions would be answered (because of financial obligations to help others)

AN is highly successful for many reasons including:

-sponsorships with unis. Since they are sponsored with unis, they have a financial advantage over bos by providing free lectures (and I believe they promote AN this way)
-having essay marking service for free of charge. Again this comes from money from sponsorships with unis
-having a more specific target audience than bos. Bos is targeted to not just high school but uni students as well and since AN is just targeted to HS students, they can find advertise in a much effective manner since they need to do it just for a smaller demographic
-advertising heaps
-“indirect ways of advertising” such as those revision notes they sell and those topic tests (past HSC questions split by topic)
-being more “active” such as being active on social media and having much more active threads. I think this comes from involvement with the moderators/admins to all the members in the community where they actually immerse themselves with HSC and VCE students wheras BOS isn’t like that since most of the mods are old. Funnily enough at the moment they have 24,000 (approx) more likes on FB than BOS. Also they have more HSC events than what BOS has on offer. Also AN mods are more active on the forums than BOS mods.
-changing year by year. To my knowledge BOS hasn’t changed much from the past wheras AN has changed (i.e. they’re more active than BOS).

Consider the fact that they were just for VCE students and have recently targeted HSC students and will (without doubt) target all of Australia within the future.

But yeah I guess BOS was successful (at first) due to the fact that it was an anonymity of HSC users on the internet helping each others and when others see they join and it has seemed to remain that way wheras AN is a forum which has broken ‘authentic rules’ of what a forum is (well they’re more unique to what other forums would be). They’ve turned it into a multieducational platform including things such as free lectures, their own ATAR calculator, a tutoring service for VCE students (looks like it will soon come to HSC), notes and topic tests, a bank of ‘recent HSC notes’…they even have their own app