• Congratulations to the Class of 2024 on your results!
    Let us know how you went here
    Got a question about your uni preferences? Ask us here

What raw marks in extension 2 generally correspond to state ranks? (1 Viewer)

TheOnePheeph

Active Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2018
Messages
241
Gender
Male
HSC
2019
The resisted SHM question given there was a special case where the roots of the characteristic polynomial were equal. This lends itself to a more 'first principles' approach to solving it in a nice way without calling upon any ODE specific theory.
Yeah I would love to see something like this in the HSC this year. Without the hint to multiply by e^nt (this might be taking it too far though), I think something similar could be a really nice, challenging last question, much better than something like the geo question from last year.
 

UStoleMyBike

New Member
Joined
Mar 7, 2018
Messages
17
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
2019
Uni Grad
2023
We all know what happened the last time they tried that *2014 HSC*. All the top students/state ranks literally did it in two steps because it could be done by inspection.

So na after that disaster I don't think they will haha

Which one? The last question? How could it be done by inspection (i had to use u sub)
 

DrEuler

Member
Joined
Jul 7, 2018
Messages
73
Gender
Male
HSC
N/A
Which one? The last question? How could it be done by inspection (i had to use u sub)
Yup what TheOnePheeph said.

Reverse quotient rule is a dodgy inspection method of getting the answer. I'll explain

So we have



Observe that the denominator is of the form (something)^2. The only way we can get this is when you differentiate something of the form u/v. As this will give you



Notice the denominator is of the form (something)^2.

We can therefore say the Anti derivative takes the form of



Now comes the dodgy part. You guess the numerator. Usually it's something simple and you should guess it as something that is similar to the integral. For example if the integral contained a bunch of sines and coses, you might guess sin(x) as the numerator.

If you test 1 and -1 it doesn't work but if you test x which is the second most simplest thing it checks out

And no this isn't taught in the syllabus. This is just intuition you develop over time or by a tutor or someone telling you
 

UStoleMyBike

New Member
Joined
Mar 7, 2018
Messages
17
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
2019
Uni Grad
2023
Yup what TheOnePheeph said.

Reverse quotient rule is a dodgy inspection method of getting the answer. I'll explain

So we have



Observe that the denominator is of the form (something)^2. The only way we can get this is when you differentiate something of the form u/v. As this will give you



Notice the denominator is of the form (something)^2.

We can therefore say the Anti derivative takes the form of



Now comes the dodgy part. You guess the numerator. Usually it's something simple and you should guess it as something that is similar to the integral. For example if the integral contained a bunch of sines and coses, you might guess sin(x) as the numerator.

If you test 1 and -1 it doesn't work but if you test x which is the second most simplest thing it checks out

And no this isn't taught in the syllabus. This is just intuition you develop over time or by a tutor or someone telling you
Ahh, that's so simple I'm surprised I didn't notice it. Thanks for the explanation. Good to know that if I'm struggling on an integral with a power of 2 in the denominator I'll consider this.

Any other 'tricks' like this to watch out for? Most of the integrals in the HSC aren't too hard (usual by-parts or partial fractions or u-sub)
 

TheOnePheeph

Active Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2018
Messages
241
Gender
Male
HSC
2019
Ahh, that's so simple I'm surprised I didn't notice it. Thanks for the explanation. Good to know that if I'm struggling on an integral with a power of 2 in the denominator I'll consider this.

Any other 'tricks' like this to watch out for? Most of the integrals in the HSC aren't too hard (usual by-parts or partial fractions or u-sub)
They generally make it pretty clear when you have to do this, but using the property:



Usually when it is done it is for something like trigonometric integrals, where you substitute pi/2-x, and change a sinx to a cosx. When you add this to the original integral, I , it simplifies it a lot and allows for you to solve for 2I. On the extremely rare chance they didn't make it clear they wanted you to use this method, look for bounds involving pi/2 and 0, with trig integrals, as it will normally be what its used for. There's also sometimes substitutions of u=-x, usually when you have a complicated function involving a lot of exponentials. Look out for bounds in the form of +/-a for these types of questions, and functions that you could simplify by adding this new form on to the original.
 

stupid_girl

Active Member
Joined
Dec 6, 2009
Messages
221
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
N/A
They generally make it pretty clear when you have to do this, but using the property:



Usually when it is done it is for something like trigonometric integrals, where you substitute pi/2-x, and change a sinx to a cosx. When you add this to the original integral, I , it simplifies it a lot and allows for you to solve for 2I. On the extremely rare chance they didn't make it clear they wanted you to use this method, look for bounds involving pi/2 and 0, with trig integrals, as it will normally be what its used for. There's also sometimes substitutions of u=-x, usually when you have a complicated function involving a lot of exponentials. Look out for bounds in the form of +/-a for these types of questions, and functions that you could simplify by adding this new form on to the original.
Why not have a crossover of trig and exponential? :p

Here, I'm using re-arranged version that I finds more convenient.









 

stupid_girl

Active Member
Joined
Dec 6, 2009
Messages
221
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
N/A
Observe that the denominator is of the form (something)^2. The only way we can get this is when you differentiate something of the form u/v. As this will give you

haha...:awesome:
There are other possibilities but it's good to enrich the toolbox. When reverse quotient rule works, it is really amazing.

This is an example with denominator of the form (something)^2...but reverse quotient rule may not be a good idea.




 

Jacobagel

New Member
Joined
Sep 5, 2017
Messages
17
Gender
Male
HSC
2019
Hey guys,

Would any of you happen to know what the marks were looking like for the 1995 HSC (i.e. highest, average, minimum mark for E4, etc.). I have nothing to compare my own mark with for that paper.
 

TheOnePheeph

Active Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2018
Messages
241
Gender
Male
HSC
2019
Hey guys,

Would any of you happen to know what the marks were looking like for the 1995 HSC (i.e. highest, average, minimum mark for E4, etc.). I have nothing to compare my own mark with for that paper.
Not sure, but everyone says 1993 was super hard, and the average for that was like in the 40s out of 120, and imo 1995 is of similar difficulty to that, possibly a bit easier.
 

DrEuler

Member
Joined
Jul 7, 2018
Messages
73
Gender
Male
HSC
N/A
Not sure, but everyone says 1993 was super hard, and the average for that was like in the 40s out of 120, and imo 1995 is of similar difficulty to that, possibly a bit easier.
Ironically that year Anthony Henderson got 100 raw, the only one so far.
 

TheOnePheeph

Active Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2018
Messages
241
Gender
Male
HSC
2019
Ironically that year Anthony Henderson got 100 raw, the only one so far.
Yeah lol I heard about that. Tbh the paper isn't that bad. It gets hard really early on like with that circle question in 3, which would be why the average is so low, but q8 isn't difficult at all. I'm not sure why its hyped up so much, years like 2000 and 1989 are harder.

Is it certain no one else has ever gotten 100 raw though? Years like 2017 and 2014 make me think it possibly could have happened again.
 
Last edited:

Skuxxgolfer

Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2018
Messages
35
Gender
Male
HSC
N/A
There used to be a crapton of circular motion questions back in those years but now they tend to not include those type of questions anymore (or havent lately), do you think that there is a chance that they might bring it back for old time sake this year?
 

TheOnePheeph

Active Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2018
Messages
241
Gender
Male
HSC
2019
There used to be a crapton of circular motion questions back in those years but now they tend to not include those type of questions anymore (or havent lately), do you think that there is a chance that they might bring it back for old time sake this year?
I would like it if they did, those non uniform circular motion qs are great
 

Jacobagel

New Member
Joined
Sep 5, 2017
Messages
17
Gender
Male
HSC
2019
There used to be a crapton of circular motion questions back in those years but now they tend to not include those type of questions anymore (or havent lately), do you think that there is a chance that they might bring it back for old time sake this year?
That's what I was thinking as well, although I don't think they will include it purely just for "old time's sake". I think they'll do some sort of probability question, and perhaps throw in a bit of sequences and series amongst it all. They may even also do something that is going to be assessed in the new syllabus. I've seen a lot of questions lately involving the Taylor series and how it allows you to express complex numbers in a different form. They may play on that, or possibly something similar.
 

Trebla

Administrator
Administrator
Joined
Feb 16, 2005
Messages
8,401
Gender
Male
HSC
2006
There used to be a crapton of circular motion questions back in those years but now they tend to not include those type of questions anymore (or havent lately), do you think that there is a chance that they might bring it back for old time sake this year?
The problem is that it’s pretty damn hard to come up with a good creative circular motion question that’s still confined within the HSC syllabus. It was a struggle for us coming up with good questions on this topic for the BoS trials (that hasn’t been done before) so I would imagine the writers of the HSC paper would have similar challenges.
 

TheOnePheeph

Active Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2018
Messages
241
Gender
Male
HSC
2019
That's what I was thinking as well, although I don't think they will include it purely just for "old time's sake". I think they'll do some sort of probability question, and perhaps throw in a bit of sequences and series amongst it all. They may even also do something that is going to be assessed in the new syllabus. I've seen a lot of questions lately involving the Taylor series and how it allows you to express complex numbers in a different form. They may play on that, or possibly something similar.
If you mean the ones where you get the t- series representation of the trig finctions and manipulating them to show that:

I think that is a possible q15 or early q16, but I doubt it will be the final question (I could be wrong though). A probability question would be kinda cool, especially if it is similar to the one in 2009 (finding the limit of the probability as n -> infinity). I wouldn't be surprised if they did a really cool conics question like the one in the BOS trial this year either.
 

TheOnePheeph

Active Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2018
Messages
241
Gender
Male
HSC
2019
Hey guys,

Would any of you happen to know what the marks were looking like for the 1995 HSC (i.e. highest, average, minimum mark for E4, etc.). I have nothing to compare my own mark with for that paper.
I'm still not sure what the average or highest mark is, but I just sat the paper personally today under timed conditions (Don't have the solutions, but I was going off the exam report). If I was to guess, I would say the average was in the 50s, with the E4 cutoff being in the 70s somewhere (out of 120 that is). There weren't many difficult questions (Apart from that circle one) but it got trickier early on.
 

Jacobagel

New Member
Joined
Sep 5, 2017
Messages
17
Gender
Male
HSC
2019
I'm still not sure what the average or highest mark is, but I just sat the paper personally today under timed conditions (Don't have the solutions, but I was going off the exam report). If I was to guess, I would say the average was in the 50s, with the E4 cutoff being in the 70s somewhere (out of 120 that is). There weren't many difficult questions (Apart from that circle one) but it got trickier early on.
Yeh that circle geometry question was killer. If you read the markers comments, only one person in the state got full marks for all of the parts involved in the question. However I felt that question 8 was relatively easier compared to other years.
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 1)

Top