Life as a Civil Engineer Project Manager (1 Viewer)

[_Anonymous]

Hi there.

So I've been considering pursuing a career as a civil engineer project manager. However, I'm not too sure on what that entails, i.e. what is everyday life like working as a project manager in the civil industry (including hours at work, duties, etc.)? What was your path to becoming a project manager (i.e. finish Engineering school, work as a civil engineer and then climb the ladders..?), and how did you know you were suitable as a project manager/when did companies realise you were suitable?

Would appreciate any insights.

 

[_Anonymous]

I realise that there may not be many (if not any, lol) current project managers who'd be browsing a HSC forum, so maybe I'll redirect this question to Civil Engineers in general. What's your everyday work life like?

 

[Drdusk]

I realise that there may not be many (if not any, lol) current project managers who'd be browsing a HSC forum, so maybe I'll redirect this question to Civil Engineers in general. What's your everyday work life like?

Imo you’re looking too far into the future. Don’t have your eyes set on just one position because that will severely narrow any other amazing options you may be offered.

Either way imo first focus on becoming a civil engineer and then ask these questions again when you do gain that experience and are qualified enough to be a project manager. 10 years down the track you may even have your own firm or be a CEO which you may prefer over being a project manager

 

[enoilgam]

Im not an Engineer myself, but I have worked in HR on a multi billion dollar infrastructure project so I do know roughly what they do. If you work as a PM either directly for the client (e.g. NSW Government) or a tier one contractor (e.g. John Holland) you will most likely be working under a EPCM model within a matrix reporting framework. So in layman's terms, the Project Managers are responsible for leading aspects of the project, for example on a 1000km road project, there might be 1 PM for each 100km section. These PMs are in turn supported by a range of specialist staff (e.g. design engineers, contract managers, stakeholder engagement professionals, accountants etc). The PMs job is to basically oversee all the different specialties to ensure they are meeting the project's key milestones and deliverables. They also manage the subcontractors who often have similar structures. So to be a PM, you have to be a jack of all trades, as in a given day, you may deal with complex design issues, safety requirements, budget blowouts and community discontent. Engineers who are very technically focused usually dont do well as PMs, as they struggle with things like finance and especially community engagement. These people are better suited to stuff like design work, configuration management or niche sub-specialties (e.g. road safety systems engineering).

 

[_Anonymous]

Im not an Engineer myself, but I have worked in HR on a multi billion dollar infrastructure project so I do know roughly what they do. If you work as a PM either directly for the client (e.g. NSW Government) or a tier one contractor (e.g. John Holland) you will most likely be working under a EPCM model within a matrix reporting framework. So in layman's terms, the Project Managers are responsible for leading aspects of the project, for example on a 1000km road project, there might be 1 PM for each 100km section. These PMs are in turn supported by a range of specialist staff (e.g. design engineers, contract managers, stakeholder engagement professionals, accountants etc). The PMs job is to basically oversee all the different specialties to ensure they are meeting the project's key milestones and deliverables. They also manage the subcontractors who often have similar structures. So to be a PM, you have to be a jack of all trades, as in a given day, you may deal with complex design issues, safety requirements, budget blowouts and community discontent. Engineers who are very technically focused usually dont do well as PMs, as they struggle with things like finance and especially community engagement. These people are better suited to stuff like design work, configuration management or niche sub-specialties (e.g. road safety systems engineering).

Thanks for providing the insight! You mention that engineers don't tend to do well as PMs, so are project managers and civil engineers mutually exclusive careers? I bring this up since USyd offers a degree in "Bachelor of Civil Engineering/Bachelor of Project Management" which led me to believe that for example, Civil Engineers can climb up the ranks and become a construction/project manager at the end with their expertise in the construction industry.

 

[enoilgam]

Thanks for providing the insight! You mention that engineers don't tend to do well as PMs, so are project managers and civil engineers mutually exclusive careers? I bring this up since USyd offers a degree in "Bachelor of Civil Engineering/Bachelor of Project Management" which led me to believe that for example, Civil Engineers can climb up the ranks and become a construction/project manager at the end with their expertise in the construction industry.

Just to clarify, the vast majority of PMs on major projects are Civil Engineers. The rest are either from another engineering discipline and rarely from other areas (Quantity Surveyors, Finance etc). Civil Engineers who are very technically focused tend to struggle, because being a PM is about managing a diverse range of issues. Engineering is probably the largest component of a PMs role, but they also have to manage finance, community engagement, contracts, safety etc. So if you are an engineer and want to be a PM, you need to consider whether this other stuff aligns with your interests.

I wouldnt recommend the Bachelor's of Project Management as I dont think it is really useful. Most Civil Engineering PMs get additional qualifications in specific project methodologies like PMBOK, Prince2 etc or even just the good old TAFE Diploma of Project Management.

 

[_Anonymous]

Just to clarify, the vast majority of PMs on major projects are Civil Engineers. The rest are either from another engineering discipline and rarely from other areas (Quantity Surveyors, Finance etc). Civil Engineers who are very technically focused tend to struggle, because being a PM is about managing a diverse range of issues. Engineering is probably the largest component of a PMs role, but they also have to manage finance, community engagement, contracts, safety etc. So if you are an engineer and want to be a PM, you need to consider whether this other stuff aligns with your interests.

I wouldnt recommend the Bachelor's of Project Management as I dont think it is really useful. Most Civil Engineering PMs get additional qualifications in specific project methodologies like PMBOK, Prince2 etc or even just the good old TAFE Diploma of Project Management.

I see, thanks for the clarification.

 

[enoilgam]

Being a Project Engineer is a good starting point for being a PM. I remember the PEs got some really good exposure to the different areas, they would talk to landowners and the community about their concerns, review tenders, go over budgets etc which is all stuff you need to get used to in order to become a PM.

Just my personal two cents, I cannot overstate the importance of understanding finance and having good social skills when it comes to being a good civil engineering PM. The amount of guys that couldn't understand a budget or talk to landowners was depressing. I remember one PM in particular having a fairly cavalier and condescending attitude towards the community. He outright refused to talk at a landholder town hall, which nearly caused them to rebel against the lone community officer. Suffice to say within a day a high ranking politician called the organisation to complain and we only just averted a major media shitstorm (which might I add is just as big a risk as any engineering issue on a project). Again, if you're an engineering nerd and arent big on much else, it isnt the job for you.

 

[brent012]

Usually, if you're a PM, you're delegating tasks and overseeing the project, and your workload mostly managerial. So if you're someone who prefers doing the technical side of things, a managing position might not be suited to you.

This, i'm a software engineer but it's the exact same there but replace "PM" with "team lead" usually.

I can't speak for sure for civil engineering and other disciplines of engineering, but in software at least there is a misconception amongst some people that a "team lead" is a better paying job or some standard form of career progression from being a software engineer. But really, as enoilgam has mentioned, some people that end up in a role like that find that they prefer the technical side and don't enjoy the admin, politics and stress of the management position and sometimes lament the fact that top engineers (at the right companies) still get paid well without having to deal with as much of that stuff.

 

[_Anonymous]

Are project engineers standard civil engineers or is that a role graduate civil engineers climb up the ranks to become first?

 

[_Anonymous]

This, i'm a software engineer but it's the exact same there but replace "PM" with "team lead" usually.

I can't speak for sure for civil engineering and other disciplines of engineering, but in software at least there is a misconception amongst some people that a "team lead" is a better paying job or some standard form of career progression from being a software engineer. But really, as enoilgam has mentioned, some people that end up in a role like that find that they prefer the technical side and don't enjoy the admin, politics and stress of the management position and sometimes lament the fact that top engineers (at the right companies) still get paid well without having to deal with as much of that stuff.

Project engineer just means you're an engineer on the project. Where I work, the grads are also just called project engineers along with everyone else (unless you're a manager). In the end, it's just a title, and it makes little difference.

As Engineers in your respective fields, what are some of the tasks you guys do in your everyday work? Are most of the calculations done using computers?

 

[brent012]

As Engineers in your respective fields, what are some of the tasks you guys do in your everyday work? Are most of the calculations done using computers?

I'm a software engineer, so it's very different from what a civil engineer would be doing and I know so little about civil that I don't even really know what my mates that are civil engineers do. Basically everything I do is on a computer.

From a very high level i'd say my work is split roughly half between more technical work (e.g. coding, reviewing code, designing solutions) and more adminstration/management tasks (e.g. project management/planning, mentoring/upskilling of the team, strategic discussions).

While I said earlier that you can stay and progress in technical engineering roles, there's definitely a shift to more higher level technical tasks and more involvement in managerial aspects when you become more senior as that's where you can add the most value - but you're still shielded from stakeholder management and some of the stuff enoil has spoken about.

Honestly, I don't think this is the type of thing you make a decision about early on in uni. I recommend taking all the opportunities you can in uni (extracurriculars like societies, internships/cadetships etc.) and getting a feel for what you're interested in that way.