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Thank you, but there's not much to be impressed with quite frankly. This debate is one of the worst I've ever had (in terms of the oppositions arguement). I find the much more productive, challenging and fulfilling discussion comes from within Marxism itself (and also to a lesser extent...

Hurray for a priori moralism! Force = Socialism? "Robin Hoodism" = Socialism? That's right, damn those lazy workers! If your poor and own no means of production, and are forced to work in a job which you dislike, where you produce more value in one form than is given to you in another...

*Fixed* As has already been explained you can't just "leave" capitalism. What we do try and do is transcend it and banish it to the dustbin of history. 1. What is wealth? Marx may as well have been replying to yourself for using such ambiguos phrases as "wealth" below: What are the...

They will survive by the donations and charity of evil altruists... This is true to a degree. Engels was most certainly bourgeois (his father was a wealthy industrialist), Marx is another matter. Due to his education in philosophy and prolific writing and study I suppose one could him an...

(Capitalism) Why do you want your boss to appropriate the value of the products/services you produce? Wouldn't you rather it benefit yourself and the community? What....? So the handfull of you will all fulfil all the roles socially-necessary including doctors, plumbers, electricians...

In any sense? I know what the "Third Way" is, thank you. This response doesn't answer any of my questions! Well judging from my avatar, my signature and the 70-odd posts I've made in this thread alone, I think it's fairly obvious I'm one of those "out-there radicals". :rolleyes: Quite...

1. Whilst Microsoft may be monopolistic in the operating software industry, it is certainly not monopolistic in the market for skilled IT labour. 2. It's workers (laregly speaking), require technical training which adds to the value of their labour-power (resulting in a higher wages). That...

I agree, my most humble apologies. That is except of course, when monopolies are established (as a result of them production exceptional products as in your example). Where then is the choice? "Oh that's simple the workers can start their own business." And if their business can not...

Lets clear up a few things here: It is incorrect to say that the LTV is "irrelevant to you system of government". Even with your clarification with the term "structure for society" you still make no sense. In what sense is the LTV irrelevant to a communist mode of production? If you are saying...

As BBJ already said, you people are such sheep aren't you. Don't worry about facts and evidence if you keep bleating "works in theory, not in practice" enough times it might make it true! :rolleyes: If you have a point, make it. All this shows me is you have nothing to add to the debate. I'm...

I understand this opposition perfectly well, however, if you are interested further in the subject I am quite happy to recommend some reading material (on the methodology, it's application and it's strengths/value) If that be case I'm sure it would be superseded. I thought I had been fairly...

Bingo ;) BTW, where you satisfied with the reply I gave to your criticisms all those pages back. I think I was the last to address them directly, so I assume you are satisfied with my counter-"arguement" [I don't think your opinions are too disagreeable, this can be seen in the fact that some...

Maybe you don't understand the difference between a "Communist State" and communism. The entry in the MIA Encyclopaedia for "communism": To each according to his needs, from each according to his ability - Karl Marx, Critique of the Gotha Program "In communist society, where nobody...

What does this mean? These facts are irrelevant. It does not matter that the employer takes "risks" or has to do "a lot of work". The reality is that the fast food worker produces more value in his time of employment than he is paid in the form of money.

Government intervention or no government intervention, this is a simple example of the extraction of surplus-labour from a worker. Of course in the case that the worker does not produce in his day of labour sufficient value to exceed his own wages, he has of course not produced surplus-value...

Quite frankly I don't give a shit how anyone got anywhere or how hard there job is, that does not justify my, or my fellow workers exploitation! No I didn't dodge the question. It has been answered, you yourself are repeating the answer. The world will be "run" by the working people...

For fuck's sake, we aren't arguing that what somebody worked hard for should be taken away! Capitalism is a system based exactly on that, the appropriation of the labour of the working class in the form of surplus value (to put it in terms you will understand; "profit"). Capitalism is the...

To clarify, the term "communist country" is a contradiction in terms. Communism must be international and is by definition stateless. Potentially. However we could equally claim that capitalism is impractical and that communism presents massive gains in efficiency (ie. the destruction of the...

If you want to define capitalism as laissez-faire economic policy that is your own business and it has no bearing on the debate [even though I think you will find very, very few people (except Libertarians) who will claim that capitalism no longer exists :lol:]. I am employing the term...

Indeed, a lot of them (and more) have been discussed previously, though the serious discussion and real questions have be fragmented and swamped by stupidity. I suppose that's the nature of what we are discussing. That's perfectly understandable, but to a degree an inevitability. I will try my...