A massive win for bogans and middle class welfare (2 Viewers)

[TacoTerrorist]

I know how it works, I just have moral qualms with taking a portion of the product of somebody else's labour.

 

[Lolsmith]

You have no clue what you're talking about

 

[Rothbard]

I know how it works, I just have moral qualms with taking a portion of the product of somebody else's labour.

Dude you are ultra contradicting yourself here.

 

[mes ami]

I know how it works, I just have moral qualms with taking a portion of the product of somebody else's labour.

i always spell qualms "quarms"
palm "parm"
awkward "arkward"
etc. brain retardation.

 

[Optimus Prime]

business owners get fucked, they have to pay tax on their own income, the company has to pay profits and they have to pay payroll tax AND the workers get their income taxed. There are atleast 3 layers already.

 

[aussie-boy]

Yeah I know, and I'd like to work as well but at the end of the day there isn't any available (especially in my area). That's the point I was making.

Get off your arse and go and get a job.
Australia has one of the lowest unemployment rates in the world... if you're smart enough to go to uni you can get a job with ease.

I'm working 2 separate jobs + full time study, no YA or RA - it's really not that had

 

[Optimus Prime]

There are people who work a hell of a lot and still go to uni full time, guy. A lot of members on here have done/do this.

I have two jobs, admittedly not that many hours a week. maybe 15 on average while uni is on. "No jobs in your area" is a bullshit excuse plenty of my co-workers are from out west, the shire, p much everywhere.

 

[TacoTerrorist]

Dude you are ultra contradicting yourself here.

How so?

 

[Lolsmith]

I know how it works, I just have moral qualms with taking a portion of the product of somebody else's labour.

You say you have moral issues with taking parts of labour but then say you advocate taking parts of business' labour. Do you see how these do not mix?

 

[TacoTerrorist]

^ I have no qualms with taking the wealth they took from their workers and giving it back to them. Really, this whole issue is more about personal ethics than the intricacies of economics. I don't think it's right for someone to work for somebody else, and the employer to then receive a substantial portion of their employee's labour. It's just bullshit. 'Business' at the end of the day does not do shit. People tilling soil, planting seeds, teaching children, mending wounds, building bridges etcetera are the workhorses of society - not some fuckwit in a suit dictating how he's going to make his wallet fatter.

Once we remove the incredible bureaucracy that supports the State and the capitalist system we will have a lot of spare potential labour. Once technology is used not to maximise profit but to lower workload, we can advance as a species. This crap about maximising economic power is a farce. We should work to make certain that everyone has a good standard of life whilst doing minimal labour. Life should not be about making somebody else richer.

 

[Lolsmith]

But just in the same way, you say you're on welfare, isn't that the same thing as stealing from the 'workhorses of society'? You're being given the money that these people have worked hard for when you haven't contributed to any form of economic process other than receiving, yet again, government subsidised education.

I personally couldn't care less of the fact that you utilise Australia's welfare system, it's just you seem to be sitting on a high pedestal without taking a good look at your own contributions or lack thereof.

 

[TacoTerrorist]

But just in the same way, you say you're on welfare, isn't that the same thing as stealing from the 'workhorses of society'? You're being given the money that these people have worked hard for when you haven't contributed to any form of economic process other than receiving, yet again, government subsidised education.

I personally couldn't care less of the fact that you utilise Australia's welfare system, it's just you seem to be sitting on a high pedestal without taking a good look at your own contributions or lack thereof.

Isn't the government profiting from giving me welfare? Without it, I wouldn't be able to go to university, and get a higher paying job and thus pay more tax.

 

[bio_nut]

So many people go to uni now that not necessarily.

And if you study arts or something, even less likely.

 

[Lolsmith]

Yes, but the government is stealing from the workers through tax. And you producing such demand for economic welfare means that the government is inclined to supply it. So you're stealing from the workers just as badly, if not worse, as these horrible corporate CEO'S.

 

[SylviaB]

Really, this whole issue is more about personal ethics than the intricacies of economics.

this is the kind of thinking that lead to the soviet union.

And we all know how well that worked out.

If you don't follow sound economic principles then you can't have a high widespread standard of living, full stop.

 

[TacoTerrorist]

Yes, but the government is stealing from the workers through tax. And you producing such demand for economic welfare means that the government is inclined to supply it. So you're stealing from the workers just as badly, if not worse, as these horrible corporate CEO'S.

The tax workers pay (which I would agree is pretty much theft) does assist them to some extent. I'm (and countless others in my situation) only producing demand for economic welfare because the government and/or the capitalist system has failed to provide me with work. Welfare is only enough to provide me with basic needs, a fundamental human right. If YA/RA is my only option, I am entitled to it as a human being, as is anyone else.

 

[Lolsmith]

Oh man.

Your sense of entitlement to work is disturbing and very wrong. Why should a company/government employ you when you will not be efficient or economically viable? If anything, you're failing the system with supplying it with labour.

And you're bringing in more 'capitalist pig dog' shit into your arguments that you say you despise. Human rights don't exist and are only arbitrary distinctions put up by a bunch of, yeah man, Democratically Capitalist states. You can't say you hate something and then use its own arguments as a justification for your actions but still say you hate it.

 

[TacoTerrorist]

Your sense of entitlement to work is disturbing and very wrong. Why should a company/government employ you when you will not be efficient or economically viable? If anything, you're failing the system with supplying it with labour.

And you're bringing in more 'capitalist pig dog' shit into your arguments that you say you despise. Human rights don't exist and are only arbitrary distinctions put up by a bunch of, yeah man, Democratically Capitalist states. You can't say you hate something and then use its own arguments as a justification for your actions but still say you hate it.

I'm forced to be a part of the system. I don't have an obligation to support it, but however it has an obligation to support me. I didn't choose to live in a society where I can be thrown in jail for growing pot, nor did I choose to be forced into 10 years of authoritarian brainwashing.

Regardless of some arbitrary bill of rights, people should be treated equally and with respect. I would like to work, but cannot find any. How is this a fault of my own? Everybody deserves a certain standard of living. If they cannot find a place for somebody, it is their problem.

 

[bio_nut]

I don't see how you can say the system has an obligation to support you, but you don't have to support it.

If everyone thought like that, where the fuck would the money come from to support people like you??!

 

[TacoTerrorist]

^ Wait, are you under the assumption that I'm lazy and unwilling to work or something? Not true. I'm saying that if work cannot be found, people deserve to be given the basics until they can find work. This is becoming inflated.