capitalism is the greatest evil ever realised on the world (1 Viewer)

[ubernuton]

note the chocie of world not humaity
discuss

 

[slickstar_01]

Capitalism, itself, is a child of the same 19th century ideology as evolution.

The theory of self sufficiency. As nietzshe put it 'God is dead and we have killed him' in that there was no need for divinity anymore. There was only the self, the individual and a struggle, a struggle for survival.

here was where capitalism was born. You take a bit of Nietzsche, add a bit of darwinism and some materialism and you have it.

When Nietzshe uttered his most famous words, atheism was on an upward rise, darwin was teaching the world that we are in a constant struggle and europe had just seen the rise and fall of Napolean.

At this point, materialism became the religion of all. War was now economical between the powers of Europe and as darwin put it, there was no need to worry for others as long as the self was safe.

Capitalism as the 'least worst' or 'most practical' option is a myth. And it's sad that it has encouraged and killed opposing concepts in the mainstream long enough for people to believe it.

i believe that if the self wants to thrive, which it normally does, there is a need to care for others. To avoid the inevitable backlash. Man will tend to drive out elements that cause them harm and perceived harm in all their forms (eg inequality). The civil rights movement broke down significant barriers of racial inequality, the feminist movement reduced inequality of the sexes, and the major forms of totalitarianism Bolshevism and Fascism, fell. Capitalism (in its implied, practised form, as is common with politics, not its literal meaning) is the third major tyranny and it too will be dismantled.

 

[Trefoil]

There's really no need to rail against unregulated capitalism anymore. If Reaganomics wasn't already a fading ideology in the Western world, it sure as fuck will be after this year.

 

[Silver Persian]

Capitalism has been bad for the environment yes. And (apparently) most attempts to solve environmental problems through market logics have not been successful (although I'm willining to be proven wrong about this...).

 

[Kwayera]

Capitalism has been bad for the environment yes. And (apparently) most attempts to solve environmental problems through market logics have not been successful (although I'm willining to be proven wrong about this...).

I'm a capitalist, and an environmentalist, so I have to admit I'm at a bit of an impasse, here.

 

[Kalashnikov47]

Capitalism, itself, is a child of the same 19th century ideology as evolution.

The theory of self sufficiency. As nietzshe put it 'God is dead and we have killed him' in that there was no need for divinity anymore. There was only the self, the individual and a struggle, a struggle for survival.

here was where capitalism was born. You take a bit of Nietzsche, add a bit of darwinism and some materialism and you have it.

When Nietzshe uttered his most famous words, atheism was on an upward rise, darwin was teaching the world that we are in a constant struggle and europe had just seen the rise and fall of Napolean.

At this point, materialism became the religion of all. War was now economical between the powers of Europe and as darwin put it, there was no need to worry for others as long as the self was safe.

Capitalism as the 'least worst' or 'most practical' option is a myth. And it's sad that it has encouraged and killed opposing concepts in the mainstream long enough for people to believe it.

i believe that if the self wants to thrive, which it normally does, there is a need to care for others. To avoid the inevitable backlash. Man will tend to drive out elements that cause them harm and perceived harm in all their forms (eg inequality). The civil rights movement broke down significant barriers of racial inequality, the feminist movement reduced inequality of the sexes, and the major forms of totalitarianism Bolshevism and Fascism, fell. Capitalism (in its implied, practised form, as is common with politics, not its literal meaning) is the third major tyranny and it too will be dismantled.

Karl Marx has said, socialism will eventually replace capitalism. I do not know if it is true, but far as I can see, all the global turmoil and social problems are forcing us to head towards a socialist world. The precondition for a workable socialist state, however, is advanced capitalism. Without advanced capitalism, a true socialist country would be senseless dream.

So Slickstar, I agree with some of your insight. but capitalism is still the only workable system in the world today. Also, I dont think it is neccessary to start a revolution or something in order to implement socialist ideals. When the time is right, we will have a bloodless revolution if neccessary. So now, just cooperate with the capitalist you hate so much.

Only until these very days we begin to appreciate the ingenuity of Marxist theory. Although I still dont agree with his belief that there will be a classless society, I deeply admire his foresight and his theory that social changes are driven by means of production.

(Before anyone begins to accuse me being a commie, can I just remind everyone there is a difference between Marxism and Communism in practice today, Bolshevism, utopianism and etc)

 

[Trefoil]

I'm a capitalist, and an environmentalist, so I have to admit I'm at a bit of an impasse, here.

So how do you reconcile the two?

Personally I'd just make exceptions to capitalism where it benefits the environment up to a point (which is what governments are beginning to do), but I suspect you're against that because it's a form of goverment regulation.

 

[44Ronin]

Capitalism existed long before the enlightenment

Obviously kids these days have no knowledge of the classics. Which is a pity.

 

[Kalashnikov47]

Karl Marx has said, socialism will eventually replace capitalism. I do not know if it is true, but far as I can see, all the global turmoil and social problems are forcing us to head towards a socialist world. The precondition for a workable socialist state, however, is advanced capitalism. Without advanced capitalism, a true socialist country would be senseless dream.

So Slickstar, I agree with some of your insight. but capitalism is still the only workable system in the world today. Also, I dont think it is neccessary to start a revolution or something in order to implement socialist ideals. When the time is right, we will have a bloodless revolution if neccessary. So now, just cooperate with the capitalist you hate so much.

Only until these very days we begin to appreciate the ingenuity of Marxist theory. Although I still dont agree with his belief that there will be a classless society, I deeply admire his foresight and his theory that social changes are driven by means of production.

(Before anyone begins to accuse me being a commie, can I just remind everyone there is a difference between Marxism and Communism in practice today, Bolshevism, utopianism and etc)

By my opinion, ironically the man with the greatest insight into capitalism is a commie (Karl Marx -- Das Kapital)

But Marx's hostility towards capitalism is too radical. Capitalism is something that meets the demand of human society and the way of production.

 

[Kwayera]

So how do you reconcile the two?

Personally I'd just make exceptions to capitalism where it benefits the environment up to a point (which is what governments are beginning to do), but I suspect you're against that because it's a form of goverment regulation.

I have arguments with myself all the time. I hate government regulation as a principle, but government regulation is what prevents things like the tragedy of the commons.

*sigh*

 

[Silver Persian]

I'm a capitalist, and an environmentalist, so I have to admit I'm at a bit of an impasse, here.

Well, yes, me too

 

[Kalashnikov47]

Capitalism existed long before the enlightenment

Obviously kids these days have no knowledge of the classics. Which is a pity.

Capitalism did come before the enlightenment. In fact capitalism existed ever since human opened the first market for trade. However it did not mature, or did not become the dominate societal force until the industrial revolution took place.

 

[Trefoil]

Karl Marx has said, socialism will eventually replace capitalism. I do not know if it is true, but far as I can see, all the global turmoil and social problems are forcing us to head towards a socialist world. The precondition for a workable socialist state, however, is advanced capitalism. Without advanced capitalism, a true socialist country would be senseless dream.

Not to mention probably technically infeasible without it as a base.

But yeah, many people forget, or do not know, that Marx was nothing but patient. He never planned for soviet style communism. He felt that socialism was not so much necessary as inevitable, and that it would occur naturally (and peacefully) from within the system, not by radical overthrow (so much as by radical reform but in gradual democratic steps). He felt that in turn, true communism would peacefully replace socialism.

I'm not sure I agree with him: I can't fault his logic so much as disagree with the equilibrium point. He felt that communism is the final equilibrium point. But what if it is socialism instead? Or even just social democracy (one of the various forms we have today)?

Either way, they lie on the same path, and the world is already heading there.