Capitalism or Communism? (2 Viewers)

[boris]

So you aren't satisfied with free services? My, did I miss something?

->Refer to making money and earning money.

Free services are fine.

If I have the capacity to pay extra for services provided for free, I should be entitled to a higher level of service.

 

[ccc123]

I would still maintain that capitalism is fundamentally flawed as a theory. It's not feasible in terms of bringing about the best for the human race as a whole (which is what I would imagine everyone wants, rather than just what's best for the minority). Evidence: Africa and Asia.

I didn't say that capitalism wasn't flawed. Invariably there is no such thing as a perfect political ideology. It's just that communism is less perfect than capitalism

 

[Dundasbro]

I think a balence of governmental interference and personal freedom will bring about the best possible situation. Not the perfect situation, but at least a stable one that is preferable for the majority.

Actually while doing Pompeii work in class I found that the high social mobility in terms of social classes was mentioned a lot. I thought about it for a while about why this happened, and came to the conclusion that the high social mobility was due to a constant supply of slaves coming in, becoming the bottom rung of society (which is required in any capitalistic society), and because of this the chance to rise above from hard work and such was easier for the people (and slaves too as they could become free and rich and all that). So yeah, maybe we need to bring back slavery to have the perfect society?:uhhuh:

 

[bassistx]

He was following me. You obviously were not.

You've been spouting on about how nobody has the same education and this isn't fair. I was pointing out that education is not a prerequisit for wealth.

I was following you when you said you were studying your ass off and "working hard".
Are you following me now?

I said education is a right. You said there are smart people and dumb people. You said some will fail and some will excel. I agree. However, you also stated that education is not a prerequisit for wealth. This does not mean that education should not be available.

 

[^CoSMic DoRiS^^]

You can't even quote properly you dumb bitch. Go back to stealing moneys off poor people, you murderer.

Shame!
Shame!
Shame!

What do we want?
Howard out!
When do we want it?
Now!

Money for health and education,
Not for war and occupation!

*shudders* Those chants even make me cringe. Filthy socialist scum.



Evidence plz.



Certainly, but most people are also rational and fair, I believe. If the world was exposed to them I reckon that a great deal of people might be more willing to move the balance in the opposite direction. Well, most people doesn't include the BoS capatilist scum krew, but you get my point. :rofl:



I'm not working in absolutes. I didn't say they didn't work at all, but I have a hard time beleiving that Mr. Rich of Macquarie Bank works a great deal harder in his board room than ol Joe Smith down in the foundry. There's a lousy difference between work and income in our beloved capatilist society, AND I FOR ONE AM ANGRY ABOUT IT! RAWR!

i'll quote you however i want to

and make up your damn mind, one moment i'm a murderer and in the next breath you're saying you can't stand socialist scum and then you refer to the capitalist scum crew. what the hell?

Anyway, my main argument for this whole thread is that if you want it, work for it. You don't deserve to have things handed to you, nor to have them taken away, in the interests of creating a utopia that wouldn't work because of human nature anyway.

 

[fantabulous]

I didn't say that capitalism wasn't flawed. Invariably there is no such thing as a perfect political ideology. It's just that communism is less perfect than capitalism

But Communism is conceptually perfect, and in practice, in can work.

 

[boris]

I was following you when you said you were studying your ass off and "working hard".
Are you following me now?

I said education is a right. You said there are smart people and dumb people. You said some will fail and some will excel. I agree. However, you also stated that education is not a prerequisit for wealth. This does not mean that education should not be available.

Where in Australia is education not available?

Stop with your shit about third world Africa, and tell me where in Australia education is not available en masse to those without the capacity to pay for a private school..

So what if I am working my ass off? It doesn't mean I begrudge those who fell into wealth without seemingly putting in much effort.

 

[ccc123]

But Communism is conceptually perfect, and in practice, in can work.

no.

 

[bassistx]

Free services are fine.

If I have the capacity to pay extra for services provided for free, I should be entitled to a higher level of service.

The purpose of communism is not to eliminate luxury services. They will be available. Your income is capped, not the same.
If you want to pay for a service, you have the right/option. Nobdoy can take that away from you.

Why? If my parents can afford to send me to a private school, why shouldn't they have the option to?

Like I said, if you are willing to pay for tuition, then go ahead. But if education is free, there will not be enough demand (I would think) to open up private schools. There would be a few, but probably far and boarding schools.

Yes, but. If everyone is going to be treated the same regardless of whether they work or not, there's no incentive for you to work. I'm going to get my free healthcare and education and housing and whatever else anyway, so if I don't want to work, why should I?

Now refer to my point about needing money to run an economy. Which you wouldn't have if people stopped working.

Services are free. But how will you even survive without food/water/etc to take advantage of those services? You need to work. People who don't work are bored and suicidal. I live with 2 of them.

 

[boris]

But Communism is conceptually perfect, and in practice, in can work.

Motherfucker, IN PRACTICE IT CAN'T WORK. HISTORY DOES NOT LIE ABOUT THIS.

 

[ccc123]

Yes, but. If everyone is going to be treated the same regardless of whether they work or not, there's no incentive for you to work. I'm going to get my free healthcare and education and housing and whatever else anyway, so if I don't want to work, why should I?

Now refer to my point about needing money to run an economy. Which you wouldn't have if people stopped working.

Qft. Although I did point out to Cosmic Doris that we do need to ackowledge that not all have opportunity, you can not have total equality, because it elimates incentive, and without that, you're screwed.

 

[bassistx]

Where in Australia is education not available?

Stop with your shit about third world Africa, and tell me where in Australia education is not available en masse to those without the capacity to pay for a private school..

So what if I am working my ass off? It doesn't mean I begrudge those who fell into wealth without seemingly putting in much effort.

I am thinking on a global scale.
Either you follow, or this discussion is irrelevant.
We're talking about utopia, ffs. It's not about 1 nation.
If it were up to me, I'd eliminate "countries". Borders cause problems. People die because of them everyday.

If you work hard, you deserve it. I said the people who "fell into wealth" got lucky, they do not deserve it in a working sense.

 

[boris]

The purpose of communism is not to eliminate luxury services. They will be available. Your income is capped, not the same.
If you want to pay for a service, you have the right/option. Nobdoy can take that away from you.

Well, people aren't equal then are they? That's called a hierarchy. Person A will still earn more than person B. Person A has access to luxury services, person B does not. I don't get this bullshit about capping income. Who determines the ratio by which you work out how much more a lawyer is worth than a council worker. How do you determine how much more an ER doctor is worth over a teacher.

Like I said, if you are willing to pay for tuition, then go ahead. But if education is free, there will not be enough demand (I would think) to open up private schools. There would be a few, but probably far and boarding schools.

What.

Services are free. But how will you even survive without food/water/etc to take advantage of those services? You need to work. People who don't work are bored and suicidal. I live with 2 of them.

Now it makes sense why you have this big chip on your shoulder about wealth.

 

[^CoSMic DoRiS^^]

Like I said, if you are willing to pay for tuition, then go ahead. But if education is free, there will not be enough demand (I would think) to open up private schools. There would be a few, but probably far and boarding schools.

...but education already is free, through the public system. I went to public schools all my life, fees were optional, the only things you have to pay for are uniforms, stationery and the odd field trip, none of which are beyond the reach of a capable adult who is working.

 

[boris]

I am thinking on a global scale.
Either you follow, or this discussion is irrelevant.
We're talking about utopia, ffs. It's not about 1 nation.
If it were up to me, I'd eliminate "countries". Borders cause problems. People die because of them everyday.

If you work hard, you deserve it. I said the people who "fell into wealth" got lucky, they do not deserve it in a working sense.

I'm not following because your argument is fucking bullshit.
It's tall poppy syndrome. It's not even fucking communism, it's bullshit. Fuck off and learn about communism in all its forms.

THANK FUCKING GOD IT'S NOT UP TO YOU!

 

[fantabulous]

Motherfucker, IN PRACTICE IT CAN'T WORK. HISTORY DOES NOT LIE ABOUT THIS.

What's history got to do with anything?

 

[^CoSMic DoRiS^^]

What's history got to do with anything?

er. EVERYTHING?

because history has already shown it doesn't work? People keep trying to do it and keep failing?

 

[ccc123]

I am thinking on a global scale.
Either you follow, or this discussion is irrelevant.
We're talking about utopia, ffs. It's not about 1 nation.
If it were up to me, I'd eliminate "countries". Borders cause problems. People die because of them everyday.

If you work hard, you deserve it. I said the people who "fell into wealth" got lucky, they do not deserve it in a working sense.

We aren't following because your arguments are illogical and incoherent. You're making them hard to follow.

 

[boris]

What's history got to do with anything?

*slaps head*

I can't believe you were the fastest sperm.

 

[ccc123]

lol I keep posting stuff and realise afterwards boris has already made my point