Does God exist? (3 Viewers)

[mirakon]

its generally accepted that this is one of his traits along with being omnipotent and omniscient

Generally accepted=/= necessary to a definition

The point is that if we take God as an omnibenevolent and omnipotent entity, the argument is pointless. An omnibenevolent entity is by definition bounded by some external sense of morality, hence benevolent. However, omnipotence is by definition unbounded, therein there is a contradiction. "Benevolence" is far too subjective a term to be vital to a definition of God. After all, who decides what benevolence is?

 

[Garygaz]

hypothetically (this is the key word) if a god existed and you went to meet him after death you'd have the right to be pretty mad at him for expecting you to believe in a particular religion. according to most monotheistic religions, about 90% of the worlds humans have ended up in hell so far.

i'm such a just god, i'm going to continue making life whilst knowing that i'm essentially sending them to an eternal suffering.

if you want to believe in that, well i feel sorry for you.

 

[funkshen]

Generally accepted=/= necessary to a definition

The point is that if we take God as an omnibenevolent and omnipotent entity, the argument is pointless. An omnibenevolent entity is by definition bounded by some external sense of morality, hence benevolent. However, omnipotence is by definition unbounded, therein there is a contradiction. "Benevolence" is far too subjective a term to be vital to a definition of God. After all, who decides what benevolence is?

thats a strawman. when god is called omnipotent, it doesn't mean he can achieve anything. he is constrained his own nature (his aseity), or rather his own logic - the highest or supreme logic (and the role of theology is to understand this logic). given this, god's omnibenevolence, his moral universality, is compatible with the existence of suffering or whatever else

also garygaz that is wrong, christians believe everyone is born with the knowledge of god (not necessarily knowledge of the temporal institutions of god). so savages can still go to heaven.

i know this sounds like ad hoc or degenerative reasoning but thats how religious folk deal with these dilemmas

 

[Garygaz]

christopher nolan knows what he is talking about; an idea is the most resilient parasite.

i'm slightly more apologetic towards those who believe in a god (not a personal god) which isn't attached to any of the worlds religions, but still it is a leap of faith. it's one thing to say, believe in theories on causation and that the big-bang required a cause and to presuppose a higher power, it's a whole different story to say this god sent the most important knowledge possible to man to the illiterate regions of the middle east after about 98,000 years of man's existence.

the defense i love the most is when you start pointing out how horrible the old testament is with quotes, and they're like, 'oh but that's the old testament i don't need to believe in that, i believe in jesus' teachings'

protip: jesus was a jew who followed/believed in the old testament.

belief through ignorance rewards the bearer with an infinity of pleasure. doubt through the seeking of knowledge dooms the bearer to an infinity of pain.

 

[funkshen]

the defense i love the most is when you start pointing out how horrible the old testament is with quotes, and they're like, 'oh but that's the old testament i don't need to believe in that, i believe in jesus' teachings'

the worst part is the old testament has the best trolling material

but atleast you can call christians reformed jews

 

[Garygaz]

watch from 6 minutes on if you believe in the bible

 

[funkshen]

picking and choosing from the bible is ironic, because it means your morality ultimately precedes the bible (the inspired word of god)

 

[thrillkiller]

lol how does it feel to have your beliefs revolve around a mistranslation of the tetragrammaton

maybe that's why you're so ashamed of being alive

my beliefs are based on the bible and LOL i think you need to calm down

So, God created Lucifer, not knowing that he would turn bad. But does this go straight in the face of the idea of God people all powerful and all knowing? He would have known that Lucifer would turn bad and Adam and Eve would take the apple. But this is all philosophical stuff, that cannot be proven. Where is all the evidence for this? Where is the evidence that Adam and Eve even existed?

God has the ability to see the future, he chose not to. The evidence is the bible. Honestly though, if this was all bs why is it still around. Why didnt people just ignore the bible and let it get lost in history? How could some random book of fiction still be powerful today. Do you think stories like harry potter will still be told 2,000 years from now?

And I think Lucifer may have been right, " According to the devil, God was not ruling through love. He claimed that the reason why God’s creatures were obedient was, not because they loved him, but because God gave good things to those who obeyed him, that He ruled, in effect, by a form of bribery." Pretty much what it is.

But what is the purpose of letting evil and wickedness continue if he is going to end it anyway? Why not stop it there and then and end all the suffering?

No, see Job.

To prove that man cannot govern themselves & He will soon.

Besides thats a dumb way of looking at things. Why do anything if youre just going to end it anyway?

 

[Chemical Ali]

my beliefs are based on the bible

why?

 

[Garygaz]

God has the ability to see the future, he chose not to. The evidence is the bible. Honestly though, if this was all bs why is it still around. Why didnt people just ignore the bible and let it get lost in history? How could some random book of fiction still be powerful today. Do you think stories like harry potter will still be told 2,000 years from now?

the bible postulates that god is all knowing and all powerful. maybe you should have a read. also i feel sorry that you've resorted to 'how could a work of fiction be so powerful?' well as a christian i'm sure you think islam, buddhism, judaism, mormonism, anglicism, scientology and all the other world religions are works of fiction, yet they combined have many times the followers that christianity does. how can they be so powerful?

 

[thrillkiller]

the bible postulates that god is all knowing and all powerful. maybe you should have a read. also i feel sorry that you've resorted to 'how could a work of fiction be so powerful?' well as a christian i'm sure you think islam, buddhism, judaism, mormonism, anglicism, scientology and all the other world religions are works of fiction, yet they combined have many times the followers that christianity does. how can they be so powerful?

Well the followers of my religion actually read the bible and FOLLOW it aswell. There are heaps of Christians, Muslims bla bla that just say they are that and then dont follow what their religion teaches.

 

[Garygaz]

you are exactly right. by doing such a thing you are readily admitting that your own interpretations of good and bad are above that of god. so, as a christian you should be bound by the words of the bible, both the old and new testaments. you cannot pick and choose what you want to follow.

if you read above you can see the many hypocrisies of the bible, or alternatively you can watch the video i linked.

 

[IamBread]

God has the ability to see the future, he chose not to. The evidence is the bible. Honestly though, if this was all bs why is it still around. Why didnt people just ignore the bible and let it get lost in history? How could some random book of fiction still be powerful today. Do you think stories like harry potter will still be told 2,000 years from now?

Because up until a few hundred years ago, it gave an answer to something that had no other answer. Of course, by the time logical, rational though and science came around and was able to explain things without the need of Gods, it was already too big and people are to close minded to give it up.
I hope Harry potter is still around in 2000 years, it taught me a lot more then the bible or any religion did.

 

[IamBread]

No, see Job.

To prove that man cannot govern themselves & He will soon.

Besides thats a dumb way of looking at things. Why do anything if youre just going to end it anyway?

I don't know if that's dumb. Stop the suffering and bring back peace and happiness to all, or keep it going for a while to show them that I am the boss and they need me.
I know which one I'd pick.
And

To prove that man cannot govern themselves

This basically just enforces what I said earlier.
" "According to the devil, God was not ruling through love. He claimed that the reason why God’s creatures were obedient was, not because they loved him, but because God gave good things to those who obeyed him, that He ruled, in effect, by a form of bribery." Pretty much what it is."

God is making us suffer so we know that we NEED him and we CANNOT go without him. Sounds like a selfish dick to me.

 

[Lolsmith]

or is the ultimate ex-girlfriend

 

[Garygaz]

that's what you have to line up perfectly when your ex says to you 'you'll never find another girl like me'

'yeh, that's the point'

 

[thrillkiller]

Because up until a few hundred years ago, it gave an answer to something that had no other answer. Of course, by the time logical, rational though and science came around and was able to explain things without the need of Gods, it was already too big and people are to close minded to give it up.
I hope Harry potter is still around in 2000 years, it taught me a lot more then the bible or any religion did.

science may answer your questions but it doesnt answer mine

 

[thrillkiller]

why?

because i choose life

also i feel its right

 

[Chemical Ali]

because i choose life

also i feel its right

Do you think that's a very good criteria for a rational adult to make decisions about what they believe to be true?

 

[thrillkiller]

Do you think that's a very good criteria for a rational adult to make decisions about what they believe to be true?

yes