Euthanasia (2 Viewers)

[russianROULETTE]

It's the religious approve actually.

Yeah, I've seen her bible-bashing in the abortion thread. Actually, that gives me an idea....

Emtaylor: Doesn't God choose when people die? If so, then isn't it really 'God's will' or whatever?

Also, as for pallative care... my mum works in a nursing home so I hear a lot of stories which gives me a favourable opinion of euthanasia. I know there are a lot of ethicality concerns and stuff but if the person wants to die and it's the best choice for that person, why force them to suffer through the rest of a life they don't want.

 

[Enteebee]

Also, as for pallative care... my mum works in a nursing home so I hear a lot of stories which gives me a favourable opinion of euthanasia. I know there are a lot of ethicality concerns and stuff but if the person wants to die and it's the best choice for that person, why force them to suffer through the rest of a life they don't want.

We're not looking after people very good in their dying days, they're in a lot of pain and are treaty crappy - might as well let them kill themselves. I think instead we should observe this case and go 'holy shit, maybe we need to look after these people a little better so that death isn't the better option'.

 

[russianROULETTE]

We're not looking after people very good in their dying days, they're in a lot of pain and are treaty crappy - might as well let them kill themselves. I think instead we should observe this case and go 'holy shit, maybe we need to look after these people a little better so that death isn't the better option'.

Don't you think nursing homes already try to give patients the best treatment they can? Could it perhaps be possible that some people have conditions that have degenerated so far that they feel death is the better option? It is going to come sooner or later, why not spare people the pain?

Think about quality of life here. What about those people whose families don't come to visit them, what type of life are they having? They're confined to bed for most of the day (which is not comfortable, they get stuff like bedsores from being in one spot too long). Things like going to the toilet aren't even possible anymore; there aren't enough staff and there isn't enough time to take everyone to the bathroom when they want. So even if you have a full grasp on your mind and body you have to sit there and go to the toilet in your bed.

That's in the best case scenario, a situation in which a person has both mental and bodily function - what do you think it is like for a person that has control of neither? Or someone who has control of their mind but not body? I would find it degrading and would personally rather be dead.

 

[KFunk]

Euthanasia supported by a right to 'free choice' is wrong imho. Autonomy is really a myth, a person is a person through their interpersonal relationships and their history (+genes). This idea that we could set up a framework for euthanasia which would allow autonomous decisions to be made seems especially to be made in error.

Maybe you're using too strong a notion of autonomy? As pointed out by Schopenhauer, we do what we will (that is, what our 'will' would have us do), but we cannot will/choose what it is we will in the first place. Succinctly: we do what we want, but can't necessarily choose what we want. To Schopenhauer:

"[M]an does at all times only what he wills, and yet he does this necessarily. But this is due to the fact that he already is what he wills."

Perhaps autonomous expression of the will is one of the truest expressions of who one is as a person?

 

[Enteebee]

Maybe you're using too strong a notion of autonomy? As pointed out by Schopenhauer, we do what we will (that is, what our 'will' would have us do), but we cannot will/choose what it is we will in the first place. Succinctly: we do what we want, but can't necessarily choose what we want. To Schopenhauer:

"[M]an does at all times only what he wills, and yet he does this necessarily. But this is due to the fact that he already is what he wills."

Perhaps autonomous expression of the will is one of the truest expressions of who one is as a person?

I then wonder what you (or Schopenhauer) make of responsibility, i.e. Is a mentally handicapped person as responsible for a murder as someone we'd class as 'right of mind' ? If a similar argument were to be thrown at me as someone who claims there is no 'real' sense of responsibility then I would probably respond with a marxist view of the law, where we see 'problem people' as being the result of underlying problems within society and thus adopt a focus more on rehabilitation and protection of the greater public than necessarily 'punishment'.

As for practical problems with euthanasia I'd ask for those interested to look at some of the ones outlined by Dr Brian Pollard in this article: http://www.abc.net.au/rn/science/ockham/stories/s1078750.htm I promise tomorrow when I have some time I'll address your post in more complete detail russianROULETTE.

 

[emytaylor164]

Yeah, I've seen her bible-bashing in the abortion thread. Actually, that gives me an idea....

Emtaylor: Doesn't God choose when people die? If so, then isn't it really 'God's will' or whatever?

Also, as for pallative care... my mum works in a nursing home so I hear a lot of stories which gives me a favourable opinion of euthanasia. I know there are a lot of ethicality concerns and stuff but if the person wants to die and it's the best choice for that person, why force them to suffer through the rest of a life they don't want.

I mean switching of the life support if the person is definently they are going to die, i mean that if they shut of the life support there heart would stop, brain dead if you like, that person is going to die and is only been kept alive by the machine.

 

[russianROULETTE]

I mean switching of the life support if the person is definently they are going to die, i mean that if they shut of the life support there heart would stop, brain dead if you like, that person is going to die and is only been kept alive by the machine.

I was referring to the part where you said that you're against using euthanasia to end their pain. Isn't everything God's will basically, so it God's will for them to die?

 

[emytaylor164]

I was referring to the part where you said that you're against using euthanasia to end their pain. Isn't everything God's will basically, so it God's will for them to die?

no sin is not Gods will, they will die when God is ready.

 

[*bj*]

You see now you're devaluing your own experiences in life (another big error). If you compare experiencing life with pain, to experiencing a life without pain. A life with without pain is much favourable when in that position.

But If I told you now, you have a choice of living 100 years in pain, or having never lived at all. Surely, living in pain is still better than not living at all.

Stupid commie and your stupid deterministic bullshit doesnt apply in the real world yadda yadda yadda stop trying to be cool.

 

[Graney]

Great podcast on Euthanasia http://mpegmedia.abc.net.au/triplej/hack/daily/hack_fri_2008_09_19.mp3

Philip Nitschke vs. some cunt Matthew Piercy.

 

[ditto]

I understand that it is unacceptable for the family of a person to allow that person to pass away while they could possibly be saved, maybe because they might feel guilty about it.. Imagine if somebody in your own family was in this situation.

But all the same I think it's wrong to let a person suffer. I would also rather die if I was in a lot of pain - I have had a good life already, there is no point in dragging on when there is no enjoyment left. What a terrible situation would that be if someone was forcing you to live.

I can't remember where its from, but the person said 'if I was a dog, you would have put me down by now'.

 

[youBROKEmyLIFE]

The option should be there. Denying people the option is inhumane.

 

[Iron]

The greater good

 

[melanieeeee.]

do you support in murder. *points to you.*

 

[youBROKEmyLIFE]

do you support in murder. *points to you.*

Murder is different from euthanasia because there is no, no consent there, is there?

 

[melanieeeee.]

Murder is different from euthanasia because there is no, no consent there, is there?

do you support suicide.

 

[youBROKEmyLIFE]

do you support suicide.

Of course. Life doesn't suit some people.

 

[Pain]

Euthanasia, Suicide, Murder - All depends on context really.
Nevertheless, staying on topic. I think the only real problem with Euthanasia is when you wish to perform it on say a family member dieing, but incapable of speech - for you will never be 100% sure of their consent. And i guess, if or not the sick family member is in the right state of mind to consent OR if the patient wants it but the family doesnt....
Alas, i contradict myself, there are quite a few problems to Euthanasia ( i've only named some as i am not fully aware of other medical conditions), but i do support it. I just believe governing and monitoring it will be extremely difficult. Whos to say a golddigger bitch wouldn't euthanate her throat cancer hubby just because " His eyes say so" ? Again, monitoring and controling euthanasia is the real deal and issue - people have the option to control their lives, even if it be to end it.

 

[HumanDichotomy]

Questions about euthanasia...

Hey guys. Just been doing some work for my Dad, he's doing a PhD on euthanasia and interviewing palliative care specialists and other doctors about their views. He recorded the interviews, and I've been typing them out. People have said some really interesting things, so it got me curious about what people on here might think.

What do you see as being euthanasia/What is your understanding of what it means?

What, if any, circumstances do you think should justify someone having it, and how should they have it?

What, if any, are the circumstances in which you would give someone euthanasia?

 

[Sprangler]

Re: Questions about euthanasia...

- Clean legal suicide in a controlled environment.

- Someone who has an incurable illness and wants to die.. or their guardian wants them to die. Not too sure on that one though.

- Wat. I could never kill someone, that'd be fucked up.