john donne- critical THEORY?!?!?! (1 Viewer)

[lose control]

hey guyz...
anyone doing this topic- plz HELP ME!! we have 2 classes at my skool in advanced, my class is foccussing on critics- like john carey and TS Eliot... but the other class is doing "structualism" and "feminism"....... i have no idea about those!!!
do i need to know it??? is anyone else doing it???
ahhh...

 

[haz_it_all]

basically there are critics like TS Elliot who said "donne is a mad kunt" (not in those exact words ) and im guessin the otha advanced class is talkn bout feminist views of Donnes work ie they think he is a sexist as shown in 'The Relique' where he compares the act of filling a grave with more bodies to woman "graves have learned that woman head to be more than one a bed" ie they are sluts

 

[Toodulu]

relax! you won't have to know all the critics! there are heeeeeeaps of critical readings on donne and there's just no way you're going to look at them all! i know people who did wrote their essays without mentioning a critic, but focused on approaches (like structualism)... etc. there are so many different ways to do this question and i'm sure your teacher would've prepared you for it

 

[mememe]

We haven't learnt any critics. Can they ask for that? All we've learnt is the different ways to value his poetry, e.g. for it's intellectualism, or for it's exploration of human emotion etc - not WHO values his poetry in these ways. Crap.

 

[ssj_goku]

As for critics, it doesn't really matter which ciritcal perspectives you do, so you don't really need to know a particular type such as feminine. However, from what I've seen, its best to use two contrasting perspectives to provide a more rounded perspective on the appreciation of Donne's work in different perspectives. For this reason, I would recommend a Classical critic like Johnson to use in combination with Eliot, mainly because its much easier to draw parallels in their arguments and contexts than sayy feminism and post-structuralism and they tie in to most q's alot better. To mememe, I'm not sure if you have to use specific critics (although we did in our trial as we had covered specific critiques). However, I would say it might lend greater weight to your analysis of a contexts view of Donne if you have a critic to back it up.

 

[lose control]

ohh ok kewl- so where can i find stuff on samuel? or do i have to find a bloody book?? do u have a website i can just go to?
but thanks so much ppl for all your help

 

[ssj_goku]

This link contains both Johnson's original critique and a commentary. Searching the web encyclopedia's should get you info on Classicism and Modernism. The attached file is an annotated copy of Eliot's criticism I found online. If you need any more info on Johnson and Eliot pm me and I'll try and find it.
http://stjohns-chs.org/english/Seventeenth/donmed.html

 

[lose control]

thankyou sooooooo much!! this stuff is really helpful

 

[ssj_goku]

Pleasure to help

 

[HannieStar]

mememe- it doesnt take long to get that together- don't worry- just look at your notes on the various approaches and there should be some names in there-

 

[emybemy]

hey guys,
do you think they are going to specify a poem? i dunno whether to risk it and just concentrate on 3 poems of study them all. what do you think? ive got no idea wen it comes to john donne, can ppl please help me!!!

 

[ssj_goku]

emybemy, even if they do specify, they'll prob only specify one. So if you have a general understanding of all of them, and know a few in detail, you shouldn't have much of a problem.

 

[lose control]

apparentely it is more than likely for them to specify one- but it is also more than likely for them to NOT specify one. unfortunately its all chance- but yeah, i agree with ssj_goku......

 

[Toodulu]

does anyone know the 2001 HSC question for donne?

 

[aleaha]

donne

Originally posted by Toodulu
does anyone know the 2001 HSC question for donne?

in response to the 2001 HSC question
it was how does the use of (donnes) personal voice shape form and meaning

 

[aleaha]

yeh how does donnes personal voice shape the form and meaning of the poems studied. good question i think

 

[aleaha]

guys what is structuralism?
I am a little confused as to this! Also- is there any chance that they could ask us to evaluate the similarities btw his love poetry and his religious poetry?

 

[jm1234567890]

the aren't going to specify a hard one like the relique or riding westward.

at least i hope they don't

 

[silvi@cghs]

basically for Donne....u have to incorporate these things:

1. his main themes and ideas
2. how these ideas are represented or created...ie techniques
3. how his poetry has been interpreted...ie critics
4. your interpretation

if u read the rubric it always includes critics...so no matter wat the question says, u must include all these aspects.....

if ur confused as to how....well....take the example already mentioned about how donne creates his own voice...

u could say that he creates his voice through intellectual argument eg conceits, wit, metaphors, etc....then say that his distinctive style has received much criticisms....eg....Samuel Johnson says that about his conceits "the most heterogenous ideas are yoked together by violence" (which is not a compliment btw)...give an example such as the blacksmith conceit in BMH where he is requesting a spiritual rebirth in terms of physical violence.....quote quote technique technique etc and then u must add your interpretation to it....u may go with him or against him and add a statement such as....but due to the nature of his request and his passion, it almost necessitates the use of such violent imagery/conceit...

basically if u prepare those things listed above, u just change ur intro in much the same way as u might prepare ur change essay and yeh.....ull be fine

ps: quoting critics isnt necessary, but looked upon favourably....but dont quote incessantly, only when appropriate....

well hope u guys luck....wish me luck too english isnt my 'strongest' subject...and i have issues with it being compulsory but neways....maybe that should be another thread....