Muhammad Cartoon Controversy (2 Viewers)

[SashatheMan]

Time to start arguing with the authorities to do something then.
Anyway I think this will all blow over soon.

blow over or blow up?

 

[davin]

So then let the muslims retaliate by burning the Danish embassies (not that i agree with it) or by boycotting Danish products. Why? because the newspaper expected some sort of retaliation and because of the large number of muslims, they would have also accepted the fact that a couple of retarded suicide bombers/anarchists would be running loose.

the heck. there is no logic. for starters taht the Danish embassies and Danish products are unrelated to the paper

as for your other thing.... not trying to restrict free speech?
- The Organization of the Islamic Conference (OIC) heads to the UN with a resolution that forbids attacks on religious beliefs.
- The foreign ministers of seventeen Islamic nations renew demands for the Danish government to punish the authors of the cartoons and to "ensure that it doesn't happen again."
- Hamas leader Adnan Asfour demands that Denmark punish the twelve artists and Jyllands-Posten
- A spokesman from the Indonesian Foreign Ministry condemns the cartoons, saying that freedom of expression should not be used as a pretext to insult a religion.
- British Islamist group Al Ghurabaa publishes an article entitled Kill those who insult the Prophet Muhammad (saw), justifying such action using the Qur'an and Hadith, and applying its argument primarily to Jyllands-Posten, Magazinet and to the Danish and Norwegian governments.
- Protest march in London. Hundreds of Muslims march from the London Central Mosque to the heavily protected Danish embassy. Chants include "7/7 is on its way" and placard slogans include "Slay those who insult Islam", "Free speech go to hell", "Europe is the cancer and Islam is the cure", "Exterminate those who slander Islam", "Europe you will pay. Your 9/11 is on its way!!" and "Be prepared for the real holocaust!"
- The Senate of Pakistan adopted a unanimous resolution condemning the Danish newspaper for publishing blasphemous and derogatory cartoons.
- Protest outside the Danish embassy in London organised by Islamist group Hizb ut-Tahrir. A speaker calls on "the governments of the Muslim world to completely sever all contact with European governments" until they had "controlled the media".
- The Islamic Army, a militant Iraqi group with ties to Al-Qaeda, says Danish citizens, and citizens of other countries who have published the cartoons, should be captured and killed

nope, doesn't sound at all like they want to limit our free speech
(all from wikipedia)

 

[davin]

I can't really speak for muslims because im not one, therefore i can't comment on what they think about the radicals. However, IF this were to happen with Jews, where a couple of radicals were doing the same thing against Passion of the Christ AND there were a couple of Jews that disagreed with the Radicals (who wanted the movie to be banned), then do you think they would protest?

I would think not because then it would turn into an ugly conflict of Jew against Jew which is not what any religion wants.

considering that the arab world has been running cartoons attacking jews for a long time now and there's been no bombings of arab nations embassies in retaliation, i think there's a qeustion of perspective

 

[zeek]

- Hamas leader Adnan Asfour demands that Denmark punish the twelve artists and Jyllands-Posten
- British Islamist group Al Ghurabaa publishes an article entitled Kill those who insult the Prophet Muhammad (saw), justifying such action using the Qur'an and Hadith, and applying its argument primarily to Jyllands-Posten, Magazinet and to the Danish and Norwegian governments.
- Protest outside the Danish embassy in London organised by Islamist group Hizb ut-Tahrir. A speaker calls on "the governments of the Muslim world to completely sever all contact with European governments" until they had "controlled the media".
- The Islamic Army, a militant Iraqi group with ties to Al-Qaeda, says Danish citizens, and citizens of other countries who have published the cartoons, should be captured and killed

You realise that these are probably all radicals don't you?

- The Senate of Pakistan adopted a unanimous resolution condemning the Danish newspaper for publishing blasphemous and derogatory cartoons.
- A spokesman from the Indonesian Foreign Ministry condemns the cartoons, saying that freedom of expression should not be used as a pretext to insult a religion.

and? You know that most of the population in these countries are muslim (i.e. they wouldn't want to hear it) and by implementing these solutions they have made the populus happy?

- The Organization of the Islamic Conference (OIC) heads to the UN with a resolution that forbids attacks on religious beliefs.

And? This would help prevent stuff like this happening again, and it would also be benneficial for other religions who are ciritcised.

 

[zeek]

considering that the arab world has been running cartoons attacking jews for a long time now and there's been no bombings of arab nations embassies in retaliation, i think there's a qeustion of perspective

Can you please provide evidence of this? thanks

 

[volition]

and? You know that most of the population in these countries are muslim (i.e. they wouldn't want to hear it) and by implementing these solutions they have made the populus happy?

That doesn't make it any less wrong though.

As for protecting religious beliefs, how can you create rules so that religions are protected? Anyone could just go around claiming that they believe in pink flying elephants (or flying spaghetti monsters) and expect to be protected from an attack. Religion is a way of thinking, and should be open to debate in much the same way political ideologies are up for debate.

 

[davin]

And? This would help prevent stuff like this happening again, and it would also be benneficial for other religions who are ciritcised.

now, i see you're having trouble with this, but the idea is called "freedom of speech". the ability to say something even if other people don't like it. this was criticism, and criticism should be allowed for beliefs, and its an unfair standard to say that religious beliefs are somehow above otehr beliefs.

and? You know that most of the population in these countries are muslim (i.e. they wouldn't want to hear it) and by implementing these solutions they have made the populus happy?

so, if the populus's like that, then doesn't taht imply that they would like us to lose our freedoms?

 

[davin]

Can you please provide evidence of this? thanks

there are already links in this thread of that.

http://www.tomgrossmedia.com/ArabCartoons.htm
http://www.adl.org/Anti_semitism/arab/qatar_cartoons.asp

or do you need links to stories about there not being riots?

 

[zeek]

As for protecting religious beliefs, how can you create rules so that religions are protected? Anyone could just go around claiming that they believe in pink flying elephants (or flying spaghetti monsters) and expect to be protected from an attack. Religion is a way of thinking, and should be open to debate in much the same way political ideologies are up for debate.

You're absolutely right, however, the problem has to be dealt with. I highly doubt that religions or the press would deal with the issue so probably the only solution left to try and prevent this from happening again is to ban religious criticism, which, unfortunately, may happen.

now, i see you're having trouble with this, but the idea is called "freedom of speech". the ability to say something even if other people don't like it. this was criticism, and criticism should be allowed for beliefs, and its an unfair standard to say that religious beliefs are somehow above otehr beliefs.

I understand freedom of speech thank you very much. You have to ask yourself what are the limits to freedom of speech and if you think that there are no limits, then you should be prepared for retaliation from ANY type of group. Do you understand this?

so, if the populus's like that, then doesn't taht imply that they would like us to lose our freedoms?

If you're trying to say that the populus would like it so that no one hears it, then yes. No one wants their religion to be displayed in a bad way. What happened if someone were to publish shitloads of articles around the world about Australia being TOTALLY racist with cartoons of VB yobbos bashing wogs?

 

[SashatheMan]

there are already links in this thread of that.

http://www.tomgrossmedia.com/ArabCartoons.htm
http://www.adl.org/Anti_semitism/arab/qatar_cartoons.asp

or do you need links to stories about there not being riots?

and then ask zahid what he thinks of jews.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

What happened if someone were to publish shitloads of articles around the world about Australia being TOTALLY racist with cartoons of VB yobbos bashing wogs?

I support their right to that political commentary - I think it's totally justified, however again it is quite difficult to change your nationality (I would however see it as an attack on that segment of australia, not australia as a whole).

 

[zeek]

there are already links in this thread of that.

http://www.tomgrossmedia.com/ArabCartoons.htm
http://www.adl.org/Anti_semitism/ara...r_cartoons.asp

or do you need links to stories about there not being riots?

Do you realise the difference with what has been printed by the Danes and by the Arabs? The Danes have criticised a religious figure while the Arabs are criticising the Jews in particular Israel.
There is a MASSIVE difference between the two.

 

[davin]

You're absolutely right, however, the problem has to be dealt with. I highly doubt that religions or the press would deal with the issue so probably the only solution left to try and prevent this from happening again is to ban religious criticism, which, unfortunately, may happen.

clearly, then, we must ban religion. if its unvavoidable. i'm sure you'll agree thats reasonable

I understand freedom of speech thank you very much. You have to ask yourself what are the limits to freedom of speech and if you think that there are no limits, then you should be prepared for retaliation from ANY type of group. Do you understand this?

so....women shouldn't be allowed to dress as they'd like, unless they should be prepared for the retaliation of getting raped?
i'm not saying criticism of the cartoons shouldn't be allowed, but that freedom of speech shouldn't be restricted. violence is not justifed based on a cartoon

If you're trying to say that the populus would like it so that no one hears it, then yes. No one wants their religion to be displayed in a bad way. What happened if someone were to publish shitloads of articles around the world about Australia being TOTALLY racist with cartoons of VB yobbos bashing wogs?

actually, as has come up elsewhere on the nationality thing, I'm an american. i disagree with a lot that gets said about America, and I will argue to defend it often, but I'd never support anyone silencing criticism of the US to protect the feelings of Americans. Not the way things should be done.

 

[zeek]

I support their right to that political commentary - I think it's totally justified, however again it is quite difficult to change your nationality (I would however see it as an attack on that segment of australia, not australia as a whole).

Yes but thats where the problem begins. What happens if you travelled to Greece, where these cartoons were published, and you were faced with racism and discrimination because now ALL Anglo-Australians have been represented as VB yobbo racists?

 

[Not-That-Bright]

The Danes have criticised a religious figure

hahaha wtf?
Isn't it actually much worse to attack jewish people than to attack a religious figure? Anyway I don't believe the cartoons were attacking muhammed. I think they were meant to attack the segment of islam which has hijacked the teachings of muhammed and used them for their own purposes.

Yes but thats where the problem begins. What happens if you travelled to Greece, where these cartoons were published, and you were faced with racism and discrimination because now ALL Anglo-Australians have been represented as VB yobbo racists?

Then that would be wrong - Just as if a muslim travels to greece and is treated as a terrorist.

to ban religious criticism, which, unfortunately, may happen.

Are you fucking insane? I'm sorry for the language but I choked on my drink when I read that... Hows bout I just start up my own little religion where we kill ourselves - LOLZ DONT CRITICISE ME : D!

 

[zeek]

clearly, then, we must ban religion. if its unvavoidable. i'm sure you'll agree thats reasonable

Well if it will help then yes, i totally agree, but i doubt this is going to happen any time soon.

so....women shouldn't be allowed to dress as they'd like, unless they should be prepared for the retaliation of getting raped?

I really doubt that what women wear is a freedom of speech. Rape is wrong and you should be killed for attempting it.

 

[davin]

aren't they attacking religious symbols if they use the star of david in conjunction with concentration camps? and the criticism was of elements of islam, not of mohommad. in cartoons, you use a character associated with it to make a point

 

[Not-That-Bright]

I really doubt that what women wear is a freedom of speech. Rape is wrong and you should be killed for attempting it.

It's a freedom. We're not just talking about freedom of speech here, I don't see why you feel the need to nit pick like that if you're so 'neutral'.

 

[UnIqUe_PrInCeSs]

uh how about u demonstrate it for us.............go fuck urself first then we'll se about fucking ourselves.............thats if we have time!

 

[SashatheMan]

Do you realise the difference with what has been printed by the Danes and by the Arabs? The Danes have criticised a religious figure while the Arabs are criticising the Jews in particular Israel.
There is a MASSIVE difference between the two.

are you stupid ? seriously, you would say anything to defend the actions of muslims. cant yuo see the hypocrathy thats taking place. i dont see How a religious figure should be viewed as any more special then critisising a race of people. and if u wanna take it further, read what moonlightsonata said, which explains why its even more acceptable to critisis religion then race.