Muslim People in Australia (2 Viewers)

[davin]

so let them have entertainment shows

 

[HotShot]

Well it's important to Australians to know about stuff that's going on with various celebrities, it's also good to take away from everything else in life. Would you rather news that is 24/7 outlining wars around the world, famine and disease? It's too upsetting.

But you dont need that to be the most important news. like its the first thing thats come up lol.

 

[The Brucemaster]

I think the amount of crap printed in gossip magazines should more than cover anyones desire for celebrity news.

 

[Salima]

No one is saying you don't have the right to be a muslim or a christian or whatever, but when you start to associate yourself with a group / ideal or whatever... then you will be judged on that.

Um...what! To say your muslim/christian/buddhist/hindu...etc. is to associate yourself with a specific ideal, a specific philosophy. And no you don't have to be judged becuase of that. No one has to judge anyone. Of course people do, becasue that is the way of the human. Humans screw many things up...including religion with their own political agendas (like what Bush Jnr. is doing right now), and agendas in the site of wealth.....it's all rediculous. BUt you can't say that the persons beliefs are to fault and judge their beliefs harshly. I am definately at fault of judging unfairly. But I am working on that. It the person behind the scenes who makes it possible for faults to occur. Especially if a human just made it up....like all those creepy cults out there!

Your message in conflicting!

 

[Salima]

Yaay for everyone who believes in any ideology but is also decent enough to respect others and not just criticise a certain Religious ideology becoz they think its fashion to do so. These days as I understand it, Islam bashing is a fashion and some so called intellectuals here just do it to feel "in".
I seriously think you kids should watch less TV and read more....

This is so true! It's been this way with any fad. It was cool ot harasse and criticise the Russians during the cold war, and to spout hate for all Germans during WWII. ANd if you didn't then you were on their side, if you siad "I don't reall care, they are people to you know, just living in a different part of the world,"...then you were a self hater and a lover of the 'enemy'. People just have to keep sight of what is really going on...

 

[Salima]

race is basically where you from very very similar to culture. people recognise culture through race not vice versa! your indian -so you eat curry?
your aussie - so you ride kangaroos?

but, there is a difference from discussing a culture, and discussing a race, and the two are not the same

also not sure why you bring aboriginals into it, but fair enough

RACE DOES NOT EXIST POEPLE IT IS A MADE UP THING! By the american forfathers non the less. To gain land, money and power from the Native americans and over the african slaves. To prove why they deserved to be enslaved.

aboriginal just means the native peoples of that country. Just in australia they didn't get no 'flashy' name....just aboriginies. And do you even know what you're saying there! Aborigines if we do say race existsed are a race too....GOD! You are so......grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.....how could you even.........grrrrrrrrrrrr.....so inconsiderate and pigheaded for saying that...........grrrrrrrrrrrrr.....why on earth! OMGOMGOMG! Brain fry brain fry! Just.......*breaths in & out deeply* Just enver mind mr.ignorance. *shakes head in dismay*

 

[davin]

Especially if a human just made it up....like all those creepy cults out there!

thats dangerous for someone to say while trying to support a religion.

 

[davin]

RACE DOES NOT EXIST POEPLE IT IS A MADE UP THING! By the american forfathers non the less. To gain land, money and power from the Native americans and over the african slaves. To prove why they deserved to be enslaved.

aboriginal just means the native peoples of that country. Just in australia they didn't get no 'flashy' name....just aboriginies. And do you even know what you're saying there! Aborigines if we do say race existsed are a race too....GOD! You are so......grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.....how could you even.........grrrrrrrrrrrr.....so inconsiderate and pigheaded for saying that...........grrrrrrrrrrrrr.....why on earth! OMGOMGOMG! Brain fry brain fry! Just.......*breaths in & out deeply* Just enver mind mr.ignorance. *shakes head in dismay*

firstly, you're making the claim that race is only roughly 200 years old? that in its own right is a very tough claim to try to make.

second, i am well aware of how aboriginal can be used, but i was only surprised that he decided to take that turn and bring into the discussion aboriginies, since clearly they would be the group that the term Aussie, as a racial qualifier, would refer to. I wasn't denying them as a racial group, just that bringing them into the arguement didn't seem to yield anything.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

aboriginal just means the native peoples of that country. Just in australia they didn't get no 'flashy' name....just aboriginies. And do you even know what you're saying there! Aborigines if we do say race existsed are a race too....GOD! You are so......grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.....how could you even.........grrrrrrrrrrrr.....so inconsiderate and pigheaded for saying that...........grrrrrrrrrrrrr.....why on earth! OMGOMGOMG! Brain fry brain fry! Just.......*breaths in & out deeply* Just enver mind mr.ignorance. *shakes head in dismay*

Um...what! To say your muslim/christian/buddhist/hindu...etc. is to associate yourself with a specific ideal, a specific philosophy. And no you don't have to be judged becuase of that.

Well you don't HAVE to be, but you will be, and I don't see why you shouldn't be. If you decide to adopt a philosophy then that's an active choice to be something. Also, in adopting this philosophy you are affecting others, thus, it's their business.

Humans screw many things up...including religion with their own political agendas (like what Bush Jnr. is doing right now), and agendas in the site of wealth.....it's all rediculous.

Yes?

BUt you can't say that the persons beliefs are to fault and judge their beliefs harshly.

...and why not?

Especially if a human just made it up....like all those creepy cults out there!

What is the difference between those cults and your religion?

your message in conflicting!

I don't think it is, sorry.

RACE DOES NOT EXIST POEPLE IT IS A MADE UP THING! By the american forfathers non the less. To gain land, money and power from the Native americans and over the african slaves. To prove why they deserved to be enslaved.

Now while I agree that race is a made up thing, I think it's just silly to claim it was made up by the american forfathers. I don't think you've understood the 'race does not exist' argument correctly.

aboriginal just means the native peoples of that country. Just in australia they didn't get no 'flashy' name....just aboriginies. And do you even know what you're saying there! Aborigines if we do say race existsed are a race too....GOD! You are so......grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.....how could you even.........grrrrrrrrrrrr.....so inconsiderate and pigheaded for saying that...........grrrrrrrrrrrrr.....why on earth! OMGOMGOMG! Brain fry brain fry! Just.......*breaths in & out deeply* Just enver mind mr.ignorance. *shakes head in dismay*

Everyone knows what aboriginal means, however we have no idea what all your grrrrrr`ing etc means - Perhaps you are turning into a bear.

Yaay for everyone who believes in any ideology but is also decent enough to respect others and not just criticise a certain Religious ideology becoz they think its fashion to do so.

A few points;
- Even if so, our criticisms are real.
- I have had it pointed out to me by many people that Islam is becomming more and more popular, who's in the fad?
- I think you'll find most people do respect you as a person etc, that doesn't mean they have to respect your beliefs or your religion. The entire point about it being just 'fashionable' is moot, there's no need for it, even if it is fashionable what does that take away from our arguments? It's ' in fashion' to believe in gravity, round earth etc.

 

[Salima]

The fact that Islam is a belief and not a nationality opens it up to scrutiny more. People can't choose their race, people pretty much can't choose their nationality - but people can choose their religion. As for why do Muslims get branded and not other people, I would contend that all people get branded by their beliefs / demography and that the only reason muslims are branded more is because it's a 'hot button' issue at the moment.

Do you not think there is an issue with muslims in Australia, nay around the world, at the moment?

I don't think that just because who have a belief you must be scrutinised more. That's a rediculous claim. Again race does not exist. You are the child of your parents and you look like them. And the genes caried thorugh them will be in you also. So if someone is french then you may have some features that are catagoriesed as being distinctly french. My dad has a european/british background and my mother has a european/british/african/carribeean background. But nobody would htink she could have euro becuase she has very dark skin due to a lot of melonin.....lucky thing, keeps away the sun! Now the same goes for me. People are astonished to see that my dad is bule('white') just beucase I brown tone of skin 'colour'....why? because I am half my mother and half my father...and with people saying this is 'black' and that is 'white' I assumed everyone would get that one of my parents would have to be of a fairer skin than the other. But no they never thought this.
My mothers father was very very dark, but his mother was german. Then that gene came out in my aunyt and she is the fairest of them all.(n my mothers family side). So no one should assume anything. You can say, they look stereotypcially this or that...or they look more this or that....but you never know what you are.

I look 'black'....no none has ever huessed my backround properly, never! I have a caucasian jew even though I have no family from that region. And I am more british/european heritage than african or carribbean. SO there. You cannot judge by appreances, nor by ones religion. Nor by what they say or how they act, becuase people could be hiding themselves away form you and you could never know the real them.

thank you.

 

[Salima]

What is the difference between those cults and your religion?

Your not going to like the answer, becuase you don't believe this is true. But in my research, I have not found any evidence to suggest that it wasn't written by god. My religion was told by god, to the last prophet (pbuh). It is gods word. Not eh word of a human who does not know much, who does not know absolute right form wrong. How can he when he doesn't even know himself?

SO there. Mine is god. A made-up cult by a human is obviuosly not. Like i said. My religion calls for questioning, and for people to prove it otherwise. But no one has so far, why? beucase such a thing cannot be desputed. The mroe I tell my mother ot understand what I belive, the more she goes "I can't find anythign wrong. I see. It is so much more logical than the others. TI find no flaws." She is not a believer, but she can accept such a thing. I have not found flaws, and I have ofund nothign to suggest that it isn't the word of god. No ohter text that has been made by human, or changed by human has been this way. This is why I believe it as truth.

 

[davin]

race is real, however waht you yourself just proved, and the point being made earlier, was that race determines very little, and is also not something oen can change, hense why one can not criticise based on it, or make assumptions based on it. However, people choose beliefs and ideas to adhere to. Those CAN be criticised because peopel choose it. You're not judging someone over soemthing that they have no say over. You can change your views if you feel strongly enough.

 

[davin]

Your not going to like the answer, becuase you don't believe this is true. But in my research, I have not found any evidence to suggest that it wasn't written by god. My religion was told by god, to the last prophet (pbuh). It is gods word. Not eh word of a human who does not know much, who does not know absolute right form wrong. How can he when he doesn't even know himself?

SO there. Mine is god. A made-up cult by a human is obviuosly not. Like i said. My religion calls for questioning, and for people to prove it otherwise. But no one has so far, why? beucase such a thing cannot be desputed. The mroe I tell my mother ot understand what I belive, the more she goes "I can't find anythign wrong. I see. It is so much more logical than the others. TI find no flaws." She is not a believer, but she can accept such a thing. I have not found flaws, and I have ofund nothign to suggest that it isn't the word of god. No ohter text that has been made by human, or changed by human has been this way. This is why I believe it as truth.

well, yeah, but then again, look at what gets labeled as a cult. Most Christians (at least in past, less so now) consider Mormons to be part of a cult. But the friends I have that are Mormon believe it. They wouldn't be part of it if they didn't believe it. I don't think it would be that big of a leap to consider that most religions now were considered cults at the time they began, including Christianity and Islam.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

I don't think that just because who have a belief you must be scrutinised more. That's a rediculous claim.

How so? So nazi's should not be scrutinised more? It makes sense to scruitinise people over their beliefs, that's how we go forward. Without people scrutinising others beliefs I am sure we would still be in the dark ages stabbing pitch forks into hethens.

Again race does not exist. You are the child of your parents and you look like them. And the genes caried thorugh them will be in you also. So if someone is french then you may have some features that are catagoriesed as being distinctly french. My dad has a european/british background and my mother has a european/british/african/carribeean background. But nobody would htink she could have euro becuase she has very dark skin due to a lot of melonin.....lucky thing, keeps away the sun! Now the same goes for me. People are astonished to see that my dad is bule('white') just beucase I brown tone of skin 'colour'....why? because I am half my mother and half my father...and with people saying this is 'black' and that is 'white' I assumed everyone would get that one of my parents would have to be of a fairer skin than the other. But no they never thought this.
My mothers father was very very dark, but his mother was german. Then that gene came out in my aunyt and she is the fairest of them all.(n my mothers family side). So no one should assume anything. You can say, they look stereotypcially this or that...or they look more this or that....but you never know what you are.

I don't get the point of this speil?

You cannot judge by appreances, nor by ones religion.

I explained that you can't judge someone by their appearance already, but appearance is not very analogous with religion which is what I think you're claiming. Once you've established what someone's religious views are, surely you can criticise them? Surely you can also criticise widely established religious views? Of course it's wrong to attach a view to someone whom doesn't have that view, but if you do I'm sure they'll clarify it for you.

Nor by what they say or how they act, becuase people could be hiding themselves away form you and you could never know the real them.

Yes, I'm also the sort of person who likes to imagine that underneath the surface everyone is very nice. However what you're trying to do is separate the words and actions of a person, from the person. They are a part of the person, even if they're hiding 'their real self' away from me, their words and actions are still there as a part of them. It doesn't disolve my point.

Your not going to like the answer, becuase you don't believe this is true. But in my research, I have not found any evidence to suggest that it wasn't written by god. My religion was told by god, to the last prophet (pbuh). It is gods word. Not eh word of a human who does not know much, who does not know absolute right form wrong. How can he when he doesn't even know himself?

But everyone thinks that... that's just a silly test you set up. What you need to do, is ignore the 'god' question, because in the end you're just copping out and saying that you believe it's the word of God, which is what the cultists will also say. So move beyond the question of God, because it's a silly one.

Now, what is the difference between your religion and a cult?

My religion calls for questioning, and for people to prove it otherwise. But no one has so far, why? beucase such a thing cannot be desputed.

It's not falsifiable. Can you prove that I am not God? No you can't.

I have not found flaws, and I have ofund nothign to suggest that it isn't the word of god.

Ok, hows bout this... Maybe it doesn't appear to have any flaws to you, and it appears to be the word of God, because it is the word of the devil. What do you say to that? How do you know your koran isn't written by the devil himself?

No ohter text that has been made by human, or changed by human has been this way.

So what?

 

[Analyst]

It's not falsifiable. Can you prove that I am not God? No you can't.

My God takes the Sun out from the East and sets it in the West, Can you make it rise in the West and set in the east?? Nominate your own favourite day to do this act... I am waiting...

 

[Analyst]

well, yeah, but then again, look at what gets labeled as a cult. Most Christians (at least in past, less so now) consider Mormons to be part of a cult. But the friends I have that are Mormon believe it. They wouldn't be part of it if they didn't believe it. I don't think it would be that big of a leap to consider that most religions now were considered cults at the time they began, including Christianity and Islam.

Its all relative, you're right. All people define cults differently.... Just like I believe those guys Jesus and Moses and Abraham were Prophets but you could say they founded those religions, hence the religions are just cults.

Well at least the prophets didnt kill others like you and other people who believe what you do are..... I mean to say the so called "Alliance of the developed world."

 

[Analyst]

This is so true! It's been this way with any fad. It was cool ot harasse and criticise the Russians during the cold war, and to spout hate for all Germans during WWII. ANd if you didn't then you were on their side, if you siad "I don't reall care, they are people to you know, just living in a different part of the world,"...then you were a self hater and a lover of the 'enemy'. People just have to keep sight of what is really going on...

Not to forget, its so cool to be Anti to the Anti-semitics..... just for the sake of it.

 

[davin]

My God takes the Sun out from the East and sets it in the West, Can you make it rise in the West and set in the east??

can we make demands of your god to do stuff to satisfy us as well?

Well at least the prophets didnt kill others like you

I'm not killing people either.

 

[Generator]

Not to forget, its so cool to be Anti to the Anti-semitics..... just for the sake of it.

Ah, no, you are incorrect.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

My God takes the Sun out from the East and sets it in the West, Can you make it rise in the West and set in the east?? Nominate your own favourite day to do this act... I am waiting...

That doesn't prove that I'm not god, just because you've asked me to do something and I haven't done it doesn't mean that I'm not God. Maybe because I'm god I don't want to take orders from a mortal like you, just as you would claim if I told your God to do that that he wouldn't take orders from me.

I say, that it is I who makes the sun rise, can your God do otherwise?

Next.

Not to forget, its so cool to be Anti to the Anti-semitics..... just for the sake of it.

Err yea, just like how it's just cool to be anti-racist to racists... it's so unfair.