No more Africans (1 Viewer)

[jb_nc]

deport anyone who is less than 50th generation white australian

 

[campbellleo]

Generator - thanks... I don't really know much about homelessness. But what you said just proved my point - that the problems we have aren't an issue of lack of money, they are deep-seated social difficulties (i.e. drug addicts and all the other reasons the article states). katie_tully brought it up (homelessness) as a reason why we can't accept more refugees, and I argued since it isn't an economic issue (as in either pay for this or pay for that) then there is no reason we can't work on both problems at once.

Az: that argument is prertty pointless - of course I don't want people to commit suicide. Once again you miss the point - that the segregation they can face over here is shit on what they face over there. Sure, I'd love it if we as a people were more accommadating, and able to overcome these issues, but the fact is we can't (or haven't). Therefore, it is the lesser of two evils for them to face sporadic ostracisation over here than face tortue, persecution, and death over there. We both know that there are a lto worse places in the world than our country.

katie_tully: I believe a lot of you are making their circumstances trivial, by trying to juxtapose the possible feather-ruffling there arrival may cause versus the tragic and violent lives they have lead to date. And I am no statistician - I don't know how many people we are capable of handling. I do know we can handle a lot more; that we can save a lot more lives, than we are doing now. Obviously there is a tipping point; but one that is defined by putting their rights EQUAL to ours, instead of putting our needs first. That is what the current system is defined by: weighing the small amount of cost, economic or social, to our community, against the incredible cost (death, torture) of not accepting them. It is racist, nationalist, and frankly quite disgusting.

 

[campbellleo]

big picture is lives are saved. lives are more important than the comfort level of the ignorant conservatives.

Well said.

Also: jb_nc, you crack me up.

 

[absolutlaura]

As sad as it is they currently fit in better where they are now. The situation effectively worsens once they come here, even without the oppression.

What? Are you joking? The only possible reason that they would 'fit in better' is because they have the same skin colour. The Sudanese government is systematically sending hired militias and government troops to destroy the livelihoods of non-muslim Sudanese.... raping torturing + displacing millions of innocent people...

Kum Ba Ya.

 

[Azamakumar]

What? Are you joking? The only possible reason that they would 'fit in better' is because they have the same skin colour. The Sudanese government is systematically sending hired militias and government troops to destroy the livelihoods of non-muslim Sudanese.... raping torturing + displacing millions of innocent people...

Kum Ba Ya.

So instead of them facing death we pull em out here, separate families, tell em everythings gonna be alright, turn our backs on them, then stick a notice in the obituary when it's all over?

 

[iamsickofyear12]

Obviously there is a tipping point; but one that is defined by putting their rights EQUAL to ours, instead of putting our needs first.

Everyone is not equal.

 

[iamsickofyear12]

How is letting a whole bunch of people come to Australia and bother us a solution? There will still be people left over there being raped, tortured and killed. Wouldn't it make more sense to fix the cause of the problem?

 

[absolutlaura]

So instead of them facing death we pull em out here, separate families, tell em everythings gonna be alright, turn our backs on them, then stick a notice in the obituary when it's all over?

No.. as i said before, the system has failed them.. a large reason for them not being able to 'intergrate' is because of the inadequate support systems we have in place once they get here..
But i still have no idea how you can possibly think that their lives were better where they were.. families were seperated.. by states of being - alive/dead... there are no obituaries in Sudan.. just mass unmarked graves.

 

[Azamakumar]

We both know that there are a lto worse places in the world than our country.

I agree. But your logic is getting at "Hey that guy doesn't own a car, lets give him one. Wait he has a toyota now, why don't I give him a free upgrade to a merc?"

It's not our responsibilty to take care of them, but they do become the governments responsibility once they allow them to settle. It's the governments responsibilty when shit hits the fan as well. They get criticised when they don't let them in, yet when they are allowed to enter under a flawed system everyone jumps onto their high horse and starts whinging again.


But as Katie said before, why not just open up the borders and let everyone in?

 

[campbellleo]

So instead of them facing death we pull em out here, separate families, tell em everythings gonna be alright, turn our backs on them, then stick a notice in the obituary when it's all over?

OK, now you are just being ridiculous. We're not pulling them out - they are begging to be let in our country. There's absolutely no need to break up families - the only reason it happens is because the current system has such low quotas. I obviously agree with the argument we should look after them once they are here - as much as we look after anyone who is incapable of looking after themselves in this country.

And iamsickofyear12? You are both contradicting yourself and STILL not make sense:

It's not our problem (paraphrased)

Wouldn't it make more sense to fix the cause of the problem?

Complete turnaround. Anyway, of course it makes more sense to fix the problem, but until someone comes up with a better way of solving problems then dropping bombs on them (see: iraq) then of course we should let people who are suffering be saved. Moron. Your deep humanitarian bent is summed up in the fact that you are more worried about 'being bothered' in some indefinable way then saving lives.

 

[Azamakumar]

No.. as i said before, the system has failed them.. a large reason for them not being able to 'intergrate' is because of the inadequate support systems we have in place once they get here..
But i still have no idea how you can possibly think that their lives were better where they were.. families were seperated.. by states of being - alive/dead... there are no obituaries in Sudan.. just mass unmarked graves.

Are you an idiot? Have you even fucking bothered to read the link, or just jumped into the argument and screamed "GIVE HUGS NOT DRUGS".


The whole fucking point of disallowing them entry is because the government acknowledges the limitations of the system. But wait, everything is better in Australia, right? The grass is greener, so is the infrastructure, not to mention the views of the stars.

Australia is not the only place they can run to. They are hard to accomodate because of their circumstances. We aren't imposing a ban on refugees, it's simply that they are harder to assimilate, and face an empty life once they get here.

 

[campbellleo]

I agree. But your logic is getting at "Hey that guy doesn't own a car, lets give him one. Wait he has a toyota now, why don't I give him a free upgrade to a merc?"

You'll have to explain that one for me. I am giving peopel free cars because I want to let them in our country?

It's not our responsibilty to take care of them, but they do become the governments responsibility once they allow them to settle. It's the governments responsibilty when shit hits the fan as well. They get criticised when they don't let them in, yet when they are allowed to enter under a flawed system everyone jumps onto their high horse and starts whinging again.


But as Katie said before, why not just open up the borders and let everyone in?

Well, if you has been paying attention at all, you would see I have already answered this question. I don't particularly want to waste my time repeating myself, so use some initiative and scroll, will you?

 

[absolutlaura]

How is letting a whole bunch of people come to Australia and bother us a solution? There will still be people left over there being raped, tortured and killed. Wouldn't it make more sense to fix the cause of the problem?

Yes it would make more sense to fix the problem.. problem with that is a little thing called state soverignty. The sudanese government doesnt want an adequate UN force there.. not that either the UN or the African Union can do a god damn thing because they are both toothless tigers... There is no country in the world willing to invade Sudan.. Why? because there's nothing that we want there..
Go get a map of Africa and a dart.. spin around three times, close your eyes and throw it... any country you hit will have something that needs fixing.. AIDS, genocide, poverty, starvation.. take your pick.. its a sad reality that many of these problems will go unsoved..
but here is a situation in which we can do our part.. but its gotten a bit tricky so we slam the door.

 

[A High Way Man]

pretty lame for the government to make a half-assed effort into integrating them into society, then to conveniently say it's not working and fuck the rest of the refugees over. lol, i find its a bit too easy for you guys to say 'stop giving asylum to refugees!!!11 its NOT WORKING', it barely fucking affects YOU anyway, cunts.

 

[Azamakumar]

jibberish

He was merely stating that if we were to stick our noses in all this business, why stop at letting them into our country? Why not go over to Sudan and get rid of the government?

OMGOSH NO!! We can't invade countries, that's wrong that is!!111

 

[Azamakumar]

You'll have to explain that one for me. I am giving peopel free cars because I want to let them in our country?

That what we have is better, so lets give it to them.

Well, if you has been paying attention at all, you would see I have already answered this question. I don't particularly want to waste my time repeating myself, so use some initiative and scroll, will you?

It was a fucking rhetorical.

 

[campbellleo]

The whole fucking point of disallowing them entry is because the government acknowledges the limitations of the system. But wait, everything is better in Australia, right? The grass is greener, so is the infrastructure, not to mention the views of the stars.

What system? You mean, Australia? They are just people, and I can assure you, we can handle - no, our economy needs - more labourers. Why do you think the dickwits in Can berra are offering a couple of grand to pop the babies out? Saying the system can't handle more people is ridiculous.

 

[iamsickofyear12]

And iamsickofyear12? You are both contradicting yourself and STILL not make sense:

Anyway, of course it makes more sense to fix the problem, but until someone comes up with a better way of solving problems then dropping bombs on them (see: iraq) then of course we should let people who are suffering be saved. Moron. Your deep humanitarian bent is summed up in the fact that you are more worried about 'being bothered' in some indefinable way then saving lives.

I didn't contradict myself. I don't think we should fix the problem. I just don't understand how you can claim you are so moral by letting all these people come to Australia but leave other people who are EQUAL are still over there to be killed.

What better way? There is no better way. The only solution is military action. Or you could just wait and hope the dictators/warlords/militia just get bored.

I am more concerned about myself and I am certainly not going to apologise for it.

 

[katie_tully]

katie_tully brought it up (homelessness) as a reason why we can't accept more refugees

Dude, no I didn't. I said why don't we fix our own problems before we run around trying to save the rest of the world? I didn't say 'no refugees', it was more a response to you saying we should just let them all in coz we can afford to.

 

[spiny norman]

We aren't imposing a ban on refugees, it's simply that they are harder to assimilate, and face an empty life once they get here.

It's imposing a ban on refugees from an entire area, and that in itself is a problem. No, we aren't required for our own survival to do this, but given the human rights ethics of the situation we are entitled to?

In America it is written "Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me". These are the words our democracies together should live by. We've been blessed with good fortune, and to shut our doors to the largest group of unfortunates in the world is not only unethical and indefensible, but it's a massive step backwards for our nation.