This might be a bit silly but what do you mean by back office and front office?
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UBS Cadetship (3 Viewers)
- Thread starter powlmao
- Start date
seremify007
Junior Member
Front office are the guys who actually make money whether it's through investment banking activities or trading. They tend to be the hardcore, highly paid and glamorous roles. Middle office are the risk-management/control/strategic/treasury areas of the business which set the guidelines and rules for the guys in front office so they don't expose the FI to too much risk or go overboard. Back office are operations roles which involve actually processing transactions, keeping records, accounting, reporting, etc. Back office/operations are the roles very easily filled by newbies (e.g. trainees/cadets) because they are jobs which don't usually involve much judgement and are repeatable processes which can be taught. Middle office usually requires some experience and insight/ideas so the people tend to come from lateral hires but some can be brought up in the FI/organisation. Front office is a totally different ball game and has specific skills and personalities required to do well.
Better/more detailed explanation (scroll down): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Investment_banking#Front_office
For this stage generally email.
seremify007
Junior Member
Degree doesn't really matter that much nowadays I'd say- you just have to be brilliant and able to demonstrate this. That being said all but one of my friends who ended up in front office did either Comm/Law (Finance) or Commerce (Finance), or coop. All at UNSW or USYD. The outsider was a science or engo student from memory but did a lot of maths subjects and ended up as a prop trader.
I was applicant 1,200 when I applied. (it's your ID number). So it's around there.
seremify007
Junior Member
How do you know that your application number doesn't include;
a) other roles being advertised and
b) previous recruitment drives?
Would com/law be useful even if you are not considering the law part at all? Would a straight out com degree in finance and accounting be a better option?? I know I want to move toward the finance sector, just struggling on degree choice/ majors.
It's much better to do the single degree and score highly then do an average job at Comm/Law.
I based it upon what I've heard from previous years.
seremify007
Junior Member
That's true, but doing well at Comm/Law is even better if you're looking for front office. I suppose it's also worth noting that some of the concepts in law are relevant to a lot of roles in front office (other than trading).
True also but note that you won't be disadvantaged by doing well in straight Commerce and it's also much harder to "do well" in Comm/Law in the conventional sense. ie HD average in Comm/Law.
Essentially there's really no need to risk it if you are not interested in Law at all.
I dont know if it's that many. Assume that 1200 apply, Professional Cadetships Australia generally only give no more than 60 interviews and that's been when multiple companies have offered cadetships. I'm sure there are more than 60 exceptional candidates out of 1200 so I'm a bit uncertain on that considering its been discussed for years with no firm answer. At the end of the day who cares about how many others apply, focus on perfecting your application and interview skills to give yourself the best chance possible of getting the cadetship because I'll tell you now first hand it's very tough and competitive.
Seremify makes a valid point about doing com/law. Law isn't just learning about the law and the legal system. It is a degree which promotes critical thinking and works your mind. The skills required to study law help those who will move into front office because of how it makes you think better. Why do you think a large chunk of law graduates don't practice? They use the degree for what it provides which is a highly mentally stimulating degree.
Bearing this in mind this cadetship would much favour single degree students. They are more flexible than those accounting cadetships but they do favour single degrees because of the contact hours. To anyone who gets offered a cadetship with UBS they will understand why, work takes up a large chunk of potential class time and the leave entitlements differ.
Furthermore people in this forum need to understand the UBS cadetship is not a front office role. If you think that's what it is and that's all you want to do you won't last. People make careers in the back office. Whilst it is a good framework for a potential front office role, you need to respect the cadetship and job for what it is by working hard in the back office work it entails. UBS is an excellent place to work but make sure you know exactly what is involved.
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True but it was all in the context of someone who wants to get into Finance, with no interest in Law. There's no need to risk it. If you are interested in Law, by all means, do Comm/Law.
applepie1234123
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Law is pointless to do unless you actually want to do something with law. For example Lawyer, \\
Or you could specialise in finance law if you wanted to (Finance law i believe it is something along those lines)
twistedrebel
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no its not. You get another skill set which is more critical thinking. finance is all rote learning with some basic maths