Why does Accounting suck? (2 Viewers)

[turtleface]

What do people think are the main reasons (many but not all) people use Public Accounting, even in Big 4, as a back up for when they fail to get into Investment Banking, Law or Management Consulting?

 

[Raginsheep]

Because of security? Theres a shortage of accountants or so they say so if they fail to get into the job they want which has a low probability of success, they try to fall back on a job with a much greater chance of success.

 

[redruM]

I don't see how your thread topic relates to the question you've posted.

If you are suggestion that people think that Accounting sucks because it is used as a back-up (I prefer the term pathway*) then those people need to learn about the profession..

*Pathways because, if someone really wants to get into finance/law/etc. roles then using an accounting grad position is merely a stepping stone. "Back-up" is loser talk. You couldn't make IB so you're stuck with your back-up of Accounting...why not do something about it? These kind of people won't achieve much with that attitude.

 

[turtleface]

Yes I agree, sorry I didn't explain what I meant.

I've recently started a mentor program at Uni, and we were all discussing what majors we were going to do.

Most of the fobs do Accounting for PR credit, but amongst the locals, and students I went to school with, it was a case of "finance, finance, finance, finance etc"

When I ask why Finance, some don't know why (i.e. following the crowd), some say because they want to do Investment Banking, some say because Accounting is boring and/or "sucks" hence the topic title, and some say...wait for it...because they want to become a Finance Manager/Director/CFO etc :rofl: :rofl: ok in light of the other thread, maybe not laughable if we were in America, but in Australia :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: . And my first post referred to a lot of the vacationers I was with, who want to apply for IBanks, and if they fail, then accept the big 4 offer.

Judging by BoS, it seems its not confined to Melbourne uni.

I was wondering what it was that made Accounting so unattractive. (i.e. what perceptions of Accounting do people who don't do Accounting have?)

 

[turtleface]

On a slightly unrelated note, I asked my lecturer who was an Investment Analyst at a IBank about IBanking

the below aren't exact quotes, but I think it captures the general meaning:

me: are the hours really that bad, or exaggeration?
him: YES! no exaggeration

me: is the work exciting?
him: not really, I personally find IT much more exciting now (he's an info systems lecturer)

 

[redruM]

Yes I agree, sorry I didn't explain what I meant.

I've recently started a mentor program at Uni, and we were all discussing what majors we were going to do.

Most of the fobs do Accounting for PR credit, but amongst the locals, and students I went to school with, it was a case of "finance, finance, finance, finance etc"

When I ask why Finance, some don't know why (i.e. following the crowd), some say because they want to do Investment Banking, some say because Accounting is boring and/or "sucks" hence the topic title, and some say...wait for it...because they want to become a Finance Manager/Director/CFO etc :rofl: :rofl: ok in light of the other thread, maybe not laughable if we were in America, but in Australia :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: . And my first post referred to a lot of the vacationers I was with, who want to apply for IBanks, and if they fail, then accept the big 4 offer.

Judging by BoS, it seems its not confined to Melbourne uni.

I was wondering what it was that made Accounting so unattractive. (i.e. what perceptions of Accounting do people who don't do Accounting have?)

ahahhah The funny thing is that they are first year students and they are commenting on how boring a major is. Subjects can be boring (I found Accounting Information Systems boring. Also Macro), but you can't comment on them until you've either done them or really looked into them. Very very few first years would have done enough research to say such things...I guess the best advice would be to tell them to keep themselves open to a variety of paths and not limit yourself to one thing.

 

[what971]

hmm. I'm aiming for a CPA while NOT doing an Accounting major for the future job security. (Probably spend an extra semester in UTS for it). I'd do Finance, but I hate maths.

btw Accounting is 'unattractive' to me, as it is boring. (And yet I still do it.)

 

[Raginsheep]

I think 1st year accounting puts alot of students off. I know students have to know the basic book keeping but first impressions do count. Its probably also got to do with the general perception in the community that accountants are boring people.

 

[turtleface]

Yeah that is an example of what I mean what971. Sorry, I'm not bagging you thats exactly what I mean, a lot of my friends are like you to, they want to major in Finance, cause Accounting seems boring.

I think a possible source of blame can be the the curriculum involved in Finance and Accounting. Whereas intro Finance may deal a lot with capital market issues, in intro accounting we have...debits and credits...

Our uni revamped the course to include a lot of new product development, corporate governance, corporate collapse, and less of the mechancal bookkeeping (ie. no special journals, worksheets, and very little trial balances) but I daresay the result was mixed.

1sst year Accounting enrolments= 1500, 2nd year= 500 in my year levels. Thats a 66% dropout rate (although this includes actuarial and management students who had to do intro accounting)

In practice, both fields involve similar work (Excel number crunching, valuations, capital market issues) but Finance just seems to be so much more "exciting" or "less boring" at University. And although I make generalisations, Finance (on average) seems to be just making use of Accounting information, so it could be even more boring. At least (Financial) Accounting explores the issues behind creating the numbers whereas Finance is using the numbers.

Its just strange to me.

ahahhah The funny thing is that they are first year students and they are commenting on how boring a major is. Subjects can be boring (I found Accounting Information Systems boring. Also Macro), but you can't comment on them until you've either done them or really looked into them. Very very few first years would have done enough research to say such things...I guess the best advice would be to tell them to keep themselves open to a variety of paths and not limit yourself to one thing.

yeah i agree. I think I remember reading a paper by Rosina Mladenovic (?sp)(i think it was by her) from USyd (?i think) where she also noted that a lot of students think they know all about accounting and its "boringness" before even doing any accounting. A lot of current effort revolves around redesigning courses to turn around such perceptions, but with mixed results

I think 1st year accounting puts alot of students off. I know students have to know the basic book keeping but first impressions do count. Its probably also got to do with the general perception in the community that accountants are boring people

lol yeah i agree, i have no idea why though...weird. what did accountants do to deserve this lol?

 

[what971]

I think 1st year accounting puts alot of students off. I know students have to know the basic book keeping but first impressions do count. Its probably also got to do with the general perception in the community that accountants are boring people.

hmmm.. So will Accounting actually get a bit more exciting?

That's what I'm hoping for.

 

[Raginsheep]

Well my 1st semester tutor claimed that accounting 1A was not representative of later years accounting. Personally it didn't rock my boat. Then again, you should really be asking those who've done later year courses.

 

[what971]

Yeah, I did. They said it definately wasn't one of their favourite subjects, but they do it anyway. Also, a friend who finished his Commerce degree in UNSW tried Acct til 2nd year - gave up, and went for a marketing major. He's now working in Singapore with a pretty comfortable salary. (Also travels around China and Hong Kong as well, so it must be something).

This doesn't bode well, but I think if I keep a positive attitude about it - it'll probably work out.

 

[Minai]

hmm. I'm aiming for a CPA while NOT doing an Accounting major for the future job security. (Probably spend an extra semester in UTS for it). I'd do Finance, but I hate maths.

btw Accounting is 'unattractive' to me, as it is boring. (And yet I still do it.)

You want to do a CPA and not do an Accounting major at uni? You know it'd actually make doing the CPA much easier with a university major in accounting.

For those interested - I work in audit, and believe me, you'll still need your basic accounting knowledge from first year. The seniors expect you to be competent with basic accounting principles when they assign you work.

 

[turtleface]

Minai do the firms care about what students think about Accounting? Or as long as they are getting fresh grads every year they're happy?

 

[what971]

You want to do a CPA and not do an Accounting major at uni? You know it'd actually make doing the CPA much easier with a university major in accounting.

For those interested - I work in audit, and believe me, you'll still need your basic accounting knowledge from first year. The seniors expect you to be competent with basic accounting principles when they assign you work.

Yeah I'm going for CPA as something for my resume, but I don't want to be an Accountant for the rest of my life so I'm doing a different major.

Not a good idea?

 

[seremify007]

I think 1st year accounting puts alot of students off. I know students have to know the basic book keeping but first impressions do count. Its probably also got to do with the general perception in the community that accountants are boring people.

When they go out and do real accounting work- it's absolutely nothing to do with book keeping. Although it does help if you know your debits and credits.

I don't blame normal people for finding it boring in uni- because so far, it has been pretty bad. I have to commend my tutors (and lecturers) for trying to make it interesting.

1sst year Accounting enrolments= 1500, 2nd year= 500 in my year levels. Thats a 66% dropout rate (although this includes actuarial and management students who had to do intro accounting)

Not sure about where you went, but for us, Accounting is compulsory in UNSW- so I'm not surprised if there was a huge drop in enrolments. It's kindof like how in high school, most people only do English because it's compulsory and if they could, they would drop it.

Btw in regards to the topic, there are quite a few people who are like that and shun me because I chose Accounting as my pathway. But the reality is, I enjoy my work, I get paid a decent amount for my work, and for those who are so close minded that they think the only people who do accounting are those who couldn't make it into something else- they'll forever be on that side of the fence; not the ones who got in, not the ones who didn't get in, but the one who was looking over the fence the whole time, never trying, and generalising and making cracks at those who actually went out and got a proper job.

I mean no real offence to those who are simply regurgitating the stereotypes about Big4; but there are some people around (including on this forum) who speak so much crap about Big4, yet they're still in uni and haven't had a proper job (or even work experience in any relevant industry) before.

 

[Omnidragon]

What do people think are the main reasons (many but not all) people use Public Accounting, even in Big 4, as a back up for when they fail to get into Investment Banking, Law or Management Consulting?

I'd say there're more people aspiraing to get into big 4 than consultancy or banking. I reckon if you ask the average commerce student, only a few think about or even know what consultancy and banking really involves... The people you're talking about are probably Comm/Law students (given you mention students aspiring to get into law). They're probably from a sandstone uni (lemme guess, Melb??) ... so the culture could be a bit different. I reckon if you take an RMIT business student, their aspirations are a bit different. They probably don't want to get into McKinsey... not the ones I hang around anyway.

In any case, those people who've heard about law/bank/consultancy and always talk about 'using big 4 as a back-up' probably say so because i believe that they believe law/banking/consultancy is:

- more prestigious
- pays more
- harder to get into (links to prestigiousness)
- sounds cool (links to prestigiousness)
- everyone gets into accounting (links to prestigiousness)
- more career opportunities
- want to be in a 'millionaire's factory'

In any case, I'm sure you realise these reasons (which are based on my perception on their perceptions), so I'm a bit cautious about the motive behind this thread. That's why I've bolded all the 'I believe' and 'they believe' so that if I have set myself up as a target, I've got a disclaimer.

Having said that, the substance of my post was in the first paragraph. But I felt I needed to answer your question coz I'd be pretty rude not to.

 

[blackfriday]

Yeah I'm going for CPA as something for my resume, but I don't want to be an Accountant for the rest of my life so I'm doing a different major.

Not a good idea?

the 'a' in 'cpa' is not there for nothing

 

[turtleface]

I'd say there're more people aspiraing to get into big 4 than consultancy or banking. I reckon if you ask the average commerce student, only a few think about or even know what consultancy and banking really involves... The people you're talking about are probably Comm/Law students (given you mention students aspiring to get into law). They're probably from a sandstone uni (lemme guess, Melb??) ... so the culture could be a bit different. I reckon if you take an RMIT business student, their aspirations are a bit different. They probably don't want to get into McKinsey... not the ones I hang around anyway.

In any case, those people who've heard about law/bank/consultancy and always talk about 'using big 4 as a back-up' probably say so because i believe that they believe law/banking/consultancy is:

- more prestigious
- pays more
- harder to get into (links to prestigiousness)
- sounds cool (links to prestigiousness)
- everyone gets into accounting (links to prestigiousness)
- more career opportunities
- want to be in a 'millionaire's factory'

In any case, I'm sure you realise these reasons (which are based on my perception on their perceptions), so I'm a bit cautious about the motive behind this thread. That's why I've bolded all the 'I believe' and 'they believe' so that if I have set myself up as a target, I've got a disclaimer.

Having said that, the substance of my post was in the first paragraph. But I felt I needed to answer your question coz I'd be pretty rude not to.

lol @ disclaimer

I too think you are right when you say they thinklike that. Although I personally disagree that those reasons have merit, especially the one about career opportunities (at least in Australia), its probably true that that type of thinking goes on.

Maybe I'm weird, but I'm starting to vomit internally everytime I hear "Finance" when I ask someone at Uni about what they're going to major in, especially people I know. Man I feel sorry for those when they choose to pursue just Finance, and not Accounting, and then find that either they can't get into an Ibank, or that the job is too demanding for them. At least with Accounting they have a wealth of options to pursue, and they can go into Finance too. With a Finance major, they seem to have Investment Banking, trading, and some fund management jobs, and thats about it. And unlike Accountants going into Finance, usually Finance ppl can't go into Accounting.

Finance, its like the new generic major everyone seems to be doing now.

I also agree with various people when they say that most IBanking aspirants have no idea what Ibanking involves, nor what they're getting themselves into. Its like a case of "lets all jump on the IB bandwagon".

I won't do IB bashing, but I think the term arbitrage is appropriate here. Theres a reason why the salaries are higher.

 

[jpr333]

Yeah I'm going for CPA as something for my resume, but I don't want to be an Accountant for the rest of my life so I'm doing a different major.

Not a good idea?

That's an absolutely ridiculous idea, if you do the cpa pre-req's at uni don't you pretty much automatically get an accounting major anyway?

As for why accounting sucks, it doesn't suck within the commerce faculty, it rocks. But within society, the word arbitrary comes to mind.