Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degree?? (1 Viewer)

[chewy123]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

I don't know anything about investment banks, but for accounting at least, job experience is really just a stepping stone for you to answer behavioural questions. So:

Q: "Tell me an example of you working in a group and a conflict occured, how did you resolve it"
A: "When I was working at KFC...this and that happened"
OR
A: "When I was working on a group assignment..."

The reason why work experience will be benefitial is that you can draw upon a more varied life experience to deal with these questions, as oppose to using only university-related examples. I know that there are a considerable number of people who have never worked and/or rarely participated in ECs and got into the big4, the question is whether is you can effectively use your life experience (e.g. ECs, travelling, social life) to demonstrate you are a person with the traits they want.

It is possible that part time work could adversely effect your academic result to the extent that you should not work at all. That would be something for you to judge. If working means you will get passes instead of credit, then that's something you have to think about.

 

[sghguos]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

yes because you are the authority on recruiting.

you have 1 page, 1 page to occupy 10 seconds of an interviewers time.
first thing i look is to figure out if you are a guy or a girl, some names particularly asians are fkn confusing
then i look at the university scores to make sure you are not retarded.
then you have 7 seconds to occupy my thoughts on something impressive you have done.
usually its your latest working experience, etc

so if i cant see you filling up a page with something better than kfc, sorry you are out.
Because theres another 300 names in the book that may or may not have worked at kfc but have certainly done something better and more impressive than it and have left it out of their resume because the real estate on that one page resume is precious.

you guys need to see reality. its harsh.

btw congrats to that other guy above me who got an amazing 3 offers with mcdonalds on his resume. thats because you were still in high school....

newbie what would you do if the resume was 5 pages long like some people.

 

[Chronost]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

newbie what would you do if the resume was 5 pages long like some people.

Anything more then 2 pages gets automatically thrown out I heard, and even 2 pages is pushing it. I read big investment banks like JP Morgan state that anything more then a page doesn't even get looked at as it doesn't show your professionalism or something as such.

 

[Trebla]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

first thing i look is to figure out if you are a guy or a girl, some names particularly asians are fkn confusing

Dafaq.

Gone through another 100 resumes this week for the summer interns next year. not one fast food mention. Maybe im in a different industry to you.

Because theres another 300 names in the book that may or may not have worked at kfc but have certainly done something better and more impressive than it and have left it out of their resume because the real estate on that one page resume is precious.

What IB receives only 300 applications and is still doing summer vacation recruitment (this is either very late or very early)?

Pretty much all the big investment banks (e.g. JP Morgan, UBS, Credit Suisse, Goldman Sachs, Macquarie, Citi, Bank of America, Morgan Stanley, Deutsche) get 1000-2000 applications (even the smaller ones with only 1 available position get at least 500 applications) and they've all conducted/finished their summer vacation recruitment way back in August (applications opened in July).

 

[Hiyahodestructo]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

yes because you are the authority on recruiting.

you have 1 page, 1 page to occupy 10 seconds of an interviewers time.
first thing i look is to figure out if you are a guy or a girl, some names particularly asians are fkn confusing
then i look at the university scores to make sure you are not retarded.
then you have 7 seconds to occupy my thoughts on something impressive you have done.
usually its your latest working experience, etc

so if i cant see you filling up a page with something better than kfc, sorry you are out.
Because theres another 300 names in the book that may or may not have worked at kfc but have certainly done something better and more impressive than it and have left it out of their resume because the real estate on that one page resume is precious.

you guys need to see reality. its harsh.

btw congrats to that other guy above me who got an amazing 3 offers with mcdonalds on his resume. thats because you were still in high school....

Can you clarify what you mean by "look at university scores to make sure you are not retarded"? Do you mean you won't consider anything less than straight distinctions? No fails? No passes? Average above distinction?....

 

[seremify007]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

I think it needs to be emphasised again that different firms/companies in different industry sectors (or sub sectors) will have different criteria and ways of recruiting.

Newbie speaks from his experience* in IB whilst I speak from experience in big 4 accounting.

* Not proven but he seems to know a lot. Interestingly, I've interviewed quite a few BoSers for cadetships/scholarships/vacation work/graduate roles who would vouch for my role as an interviewer.

 

[Newbie]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

Dafaq.

What IB receives only 300 applications and is still doing summer vacation recruitment (this is either very late or very early)?

Pretty much all the big investment banks (e.g. JP Morgan, UBS, Credit Suisse, Goldman Sachs, Macquarie, Citi, Bank of America, Morgan Stanley, Deutsche) get 1000-2000 applications (even the smaller ones with only 1 available position get at least 500 applications) and they've all conducted/finished their summer vacation recruitment way back in August (applications opened in July).

lol as i said its the asian.s i give you name. Rui Huang and Rui Su
ones a hot chick (hired), ones a guy (sorry bl). just cant fkn tell.

i work in asia. and we have 15 team looking at 400-500 resumes each, basically the entire bank is reviewing resumes during the last two weeks of december as equity and debt markets close.

also to someone elses' question - yes you only get 1 page. but in the application you also get to fill out written responses to questions so you can explain your "story" there. theres usually a character limit in those questions but its pretty generous.

banks look for a 3.5+ GPA from ivy league/oxbridge. of course we get occasionally randoms that dont even go to university yet, but their daddies fly private so whatever.
in australia, the usual is at least a distinction average for comlaw and even higher average and first class honors from those that study com. Also, university matters, (UNSW, USYD and lesser extent UTS, MACQ). ANU comes out sometimes but gotta be special, there was one guy who invented some chemical compound or somesht. he works in the real estate team.

and yes having done the big4 interview process as well, its much nicer, much more personality based, lots of hugs no technical questions, no direct questions like "why did you do so badly in this subject?" "why dont you understand this valuation question" or asshole statements like "i dont think this is good enough".

 

[brent012]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

Newbie, i know this is a tad offtopic but you seem to know what you are talking about. I'm studying software engineering and spoke to some company at a careers fair (don't think they were top tier but still large and have since forgotten their name), the guy there reckoned that they have hired engineers before who have ended up trading and said the recruiters actually like engineers as they are often very analytically minded. What im wondering is, just how hard is it for an engineer to get a job in the finance sector? It seems they have very rigorous criteria to select employees so it seems close to impossible that an engineer would be competitive.

I want to be a software developer or get a job in software or IT at the moment, but 10 years down the line i'm not sure what i'll be thinking and i want to keep my options open. Finance is something that has interested me for awhile now but i don't know too much about it which is probably very obvious to you by now haha. I'm guessing engineers, particularly software engineers, would probably get a job like that through networking and having connections through working for banks? What's your take on all of this?


EDIT: Oh, this question doesn't neccesarily have to be aimed at Newbie but i want an informed answer.

 

[seremify007]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

^ depends how good you are at maths. Prop trader potential.

 

[Drifting95]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

lol as i said its the asian.s i give you name. Rui Huang and Rui Su
ones a hot chick (hired), ones a guy (sorry bl). just cant fkn tell.

i work in asia. and we have 15 team looking at 400-500 resumes each, basically the entire bank is reviewing resumes during the last two weeks of december as equity and debt markets close.

also to someone elses' question - yes you only get 1 page. but in the application you also get to fill out written responses to questions so you can explain your "story" there. theres usually a character limit in those questions but its pretty generous.

banks look for a 3.5+ GPA from ivy league/oxbridge. of course we get occasionally randoms that dont even go to university yet, but their daddies fly private so whatever.
in australia, the usual is at least a distinction average for comlaw and even higher average and first class honors from those that study com. Also, university matters, (UNSW, USYD and lesser extent UTS, MACQ). ANU comes out sometimes but gotta be special, there was one guy who invented some chemical compound or somesht. he works in the real estate team.

and yes having done the big4 interview process as well, its much nicer, much more personality based, lots of hugs no technical questions, no direct questions like "why did you do so badly in this subject?" "why dont you understand this valuation question" or asshole statements like "i dont think this is good enough".

Would Honours still be needed if one was to take a grad job at a big 4 accounting firm after completing a cadetship instead? Would a cadetship even help in anyway?

 

[Omnidragon]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

I don't know anything about investment banks, but for accounting at least, job experience is really just a stepping stone for you to answer behavioural questions. So:

Q: "Tell me an example of you working in a group and a conflict occured, how did you resolve it"
A: "When I was working at KFC...this and that happened"
OR
A: "When I was working on a group assignment..."

The reason why work experience will be benefitial is that you can draw upon a more varied life experience to deal with these questions, as oppose to using only university-related examples. I know that there are a considerable number of people who have never worked and/or rarely participated in ECs and got into the big4, the question is whether is you can effectively use your life experience (e.g. ECs, travelling, social life) to demonstrate you are a person with the traits they want.

It is possible that part time work could adversely effect your academic result to the extent that you should not work at all. That would be something for you to judge. If working means you will get passes instead of credit, then that's something you have to think about.

Well yes they are different (big 4 and ibank interviews).

And that's why when I graduated I made $165k in my first year and big 4 grads made $40k.

 

[Omnidragon]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

newbie what would you do if the resume was 5 pages long like some people.

I would look at it in 10 seconds and see if anything caught my eye, like Cadet to Elizabeth II, shoeboy for PRC General of North East Armies. As mentioned, if I only saw KFC and McDonalds I would throw it out in 5 seconds.

 

[Trebla]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

i work in asia. and we have 15 team looking at 400-500 resumes each, basically the entire bank is reviewing resumes during the last two weeks of december as equity and debt markets close.

No wonder. The standards might be a little different than it is here. My views are based on information that recruiters have told me during their visits on campus and my personal experience in going through many recruitment processes.

also to someone elses' question - yes you only get 1 page. but in the application you also get to fill out written responses to questions so you can explain your "story" there. theres usually a character limit in those questions but its pretty generous.

In Australia, very few banks actually specify that the resume has to be one page (generally those who are big global IBs but don't have a large presence in Australia). The general rule of thumb here is around 2 pages (or 3 pages max). Most people I know who work at IBs have had their resumes around 2 pages and I myself have progressed to the next round of recuitment by IBs with a 2 page resume.

in australia, the usual is at least a distinction average for comlaw and even higher average and first class honors from those that study com. Also, university matters, (UNSW, USYD and lesser extent UTS, MACQ). ANU comes out sometimes but gotta be special, there was one guy who invented some chemical compound or somesht. he works in the real estate team.

The grade average is not of great importance in Australia for most IBs. Most accept those with at least a credit average (you can see this on their websites). I know a few people who have successfully acquired vaction/graduate positions in IBs with just a credit average. Recruiters look for all roundedness, so you need "decent" grades, a good variety of work experience and good extra-curriculars. Of course you will also need to demonstrate their core competencies and values (e.g. teamwork, passion for finance) and then do well in testing and interviews.

 

[Trebla]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

Newbie, i know this is a tad offtopic but you seem to know what you are talking about. I'm studying software engineering and spoke to some company at a careers fair (don't think they were top tier but still large and have since forgotten their name), the guy there reckoned that they have hired engineers before who have ended up trading and said the recruiters actually like engineers as they are often very analytically minded. What im wondering is, just how hard is it for an engineer to get a job in the finance sector? It seems they have very rigorous criteria to select employees so it seems close to impossible that an engineer would be competitive.

I want to be a software developer or get a job in software or IT at the moment, but 10 years down the line i'm not sure what i'll be thinking and i want to keep my options open. Finance is something that has interested me for awhile now but i don't know too much about it which is probably very obvious to you by now haha. I'm guessing engineers, particularly software engineers, would probably get a job like that through networking and having connections through working for banks? What's your take on all of this?


EDIT: Oh, this question doesn't neccesarily have to be aimed at Newbie but i want an informed answer.

It does not matter what degree you studied as long as you have an interest in finance and demonstrate that you have good skills and experiences. I have a friend who only did BSc(Adv Mathematics) without honours and now works at Morgan Stanley.

As for software engineers, you can try out being a trader or you can do software engineering for the banks. Many prop trading places like Optiver, IMC or Liquid Capital need IT people to configure their software to be fast enough for high frequency trading.

 

[Omnidragon]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

You must be talking about some middle-office or back-office role or some unlucrative front office role like PWM or Asset Management.

 

[Newbie]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

i think credit average is pushing it for IB. btw yeah this is IB front office, so simplying working at the bank doesnt count.

in fact the only person i know who works in IB that had a credit average going into the interview was...me. LOL they might have thought my daddy was on the forbes list. (its not)

 

[brent012]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

It does not matter what degree you studied as long as you have an interest in finance and demonstrate that you have good skills and experiences. I have a friend who only did BSc(Adv Mathematics) without honours and now works at Morgan Stanley.

As for software engineers, you can try out being a trader or you can do software engineering for the banks. Many prop trading places like Optiver, IMC or Liquid Capital need IT people to configure their software to be fast enough for high frequency trading.

Thanks! Oh and now you mention it, Optiver was who i talked to at the careers fair thing i mentioned.

 

[Trebla]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

You must be talking about some middle-office or back-office role or some unlucrative front office role like PWM or Asset Management.

Nope. I'm talking about actual investment banking (M&A deals etc). I have a friend currently working for Deutsche in IBD who 'only' has a credit average (she doesn't have family networks either, in fact she came from a low income family background). I also know a couple of people who have progressed passed the application stage of trading roles with a credit average. It is not common but it does happen.

As mentioned before, grades are not a key factor but you do have to be all rounded. Once you've passed the application stage, any importance of grades goes out the window and it is more about your personality and achievements.

 

[Omnidragon]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

Which office is she in? Syd or Melb? Analyst monkey?

 

[Chronost]

Re: Will part-time job experience help get a job after completing a commerce/eco degr

i think credit average is pushing it for IB. btw yeah this is IB front office, so simplying working at the bank doesnt count.

in fact the only person i know who works in IB that had a credit average going into the interview was...me. LOL they might have thought my daddy was on the forbes list. (its not)

Pro!