Afghan women: be sexually obedient to your husbands or starve (3 Viewers)

[Sprangler]

I'm muslim, and something tells me the truth is not quite out there about the full legislation of these laws. But if this is the case with Afghanistan then I do not understand how they can justify any of this under Islamic/sharia law (since they call themselves an Islamic country). I find is quiet repulsive, and if this is the case well no society should tolerate such incidents, culture isn't a good enough reason. Although this could be because Afganistan has been influenced heavily over the years by the Taliban who have been really selective and quiet unislamic about their conduct, regardless something tells me this is media sensationalisation, it has happened before, I hope a report comes quick from the united nations, and neighbouring countries/agencies, cause if that is what happening to those women, well people need to act fast.

ahh Iraq, Iran, and Afganistan probably the most unstable counties in th world right now, well really the whole place is, even neutral jordan and jewish Isreal. Stop all war, plz

Don't bring Israel into this, all of Israel's wars have been caused by Muslim countries. It's perfectly stable at the moment.

 

[Planck]

I'm muslim, and something tells me the truth is not quite out there about the full legislation of these laws. But if this is the case with Afghanistan then I do not understand how they can justify any of this under Islamic/sharia law (since they call themselves an Islamic country).

Urk this is as bad as communists saying that the USSR is a poor example of why communism is bullshit. [State capitalism lol]. I'm sorry but you judge a religion on its adherents and how they work, not whether they interpret something the same way you do. Sunnis v Shia it all comes out in the wash anyway.

I find is quiet repulsive, and if this is the case well no society should tolerate such incidents, culture isn't a good enough reason. Although this could be because Afganistan has been influenced heavily over the years by the Taliban who have been really selective and quiet unislamic about their conduct

I'd say they'd posit you were the apostate in the bunch, mate. Pronouncements don't validate your statements. Just because you point the finger and say "BUT BUT BUT THEY DIDN"T TURN AROUND *FIVE* TIMES BEFORE THEY SHOT THAT GUY" doesn't mean their religion is first and foremost the issue at hand here. You don't have to defend them or your religion purely because it's being criticised. If you're not going to jump on a bus and blow people to smithereens you effectively have no dog in this fight.

, regardless something tells me this is media sensationalisation, it has happened before, I hope a report comes quick from the united nations, and neighbouring countries/agencies, cause if that is what happening to those women, well people need to act fast.

Yeah because we'll trust the United Nations on anything pertaining to Islam or the Middle East.

ahh Iraq, Iran, and Afganistan probably the most unstable counties in th world right now, well really the whole place is, even neutral jordan and jewish Isreal. Stop all war, plz

What does Israel have to do with anything? It's a peaceful and secular country that is under constant threat of annihilation.

 

[Azarnakumar]

Yeah but Western Civilization > Islamic Civilization by a long mile.

Economic indicators, standards of living, life expectancy, government transparency, individual rights and freedoms, etc.

Anyone saying the two are 'equal' is a moron.

exactly what i said

patriot

 

[CountVonChocula]

best thing since sliced bread

olol

 

[ashie0]

Yeah but Western Civilization > Islamic Civilization by a long mile.

Economic indicators, standards of living, life expectancy, government transparency, individual rights and freedoms, etc.

Anyone saying the two are 'equal' is a moron.

not equal, different.

Cultural relativism is axiomatically hypocritical, if you were older than four, you'd realise this you budding little trot.

Freedom is the right of all sentient beings.

I can believe in both cultural relativism and human rights.

 

[Planck]

I can believe in both cultural relativism and human rights.

No, you can't due to the nature of cultural relativism.

Relativism holds that everything is up for grabs except for its central tenets. It's contradictory and axiomatically unsound.

To argue that all are different and can't be compared is juvenile and intellectually devoid. It's fatuous wish thinking along the lines of woo and alternative medicine.

You can compare these things directly because we have indicators to compare them. Life expectancy, government transperancy, etc.

Freedom is better than slavery.

Democracy is better than dictatorships

Equality is better than inequality.

To argue anything different indicates how useless and juvenile such wish-thinking is. You through your grotesque interpretation of reality enable dictators and put the machetes in the hands of those who would wish to behead you.

You utter fool

 

[Azarnakumar]

not equal, different.







I can believe in both cultural relativism and human rights.

hitlers views on the jews were not wrong, just different
ted bundys views on women were not wrong, just different
my views on the abos are not wrong, just different (personal opinion expressing a valid point plz dont ban)

 

[ashie0]

hitlers views on the jews were not wrong, just different
ted bundys views on women were not wrong, just different
my views on the abos are not wrong, just different (personal opinion expressing a valid point plz dont ban)

i'm not using cultural relativism to excuse the law this thread discusses, just like cultural relativism doesn't excuse hitlers persecution of jews. i just don't believe you can compare cultures or say one is superior to the other. different cultures have different values and beliefs and they're not comparable.
i think the law is disgusting and not representative of islam or the majority of the islamic community. the interpretation of islam in order to devise this law is one i disagree with, and i can reject that interpretation and still maintain a belief in cultural relativism.

 

[Planck]

i'm not using cultural relativism to excuse the law this thread discusses, just like cultural relativism doesn't excuse hitlers persecution of jews. i just don't believe you can compare cultures or say one is superior to the other. different cultures have different values and beliefs and they're not comparable.
i think the law is disgusting and not representative of islam or the majority of the islamic community. the interpretation of islam in order to devise this law is one i disagree with, and i can reject that interpretation and still maintain a belief in cultural relativism.

So you ignore my points, create a vacuous straw man and then consider your argument valid?

You sicken me and you put a smile on the face of despots everywhere.

 

[Planck]

[youtube]uYWg3zSXiBw[/youtube]

 

[spyro14]

Well apart from the fact that the Youtube video goes for way too long, I'd say it pretty much sums up the ideal world that we don't have today.

 

[throwaway]

in the ideal world my chemical romance would be playing in the streets of london all day every day

off to london

adios

 

[ashie0]

So you ignore my points, create a vacuous straw man and then consider your argument valid?

You sicken me and you put a smile on the face of despots everywhere.

i was completely unaware you posted something at that point.
i'll reply when i'm not full of sleeping pills. you've missed my point.

edit: whatever, here goes.

we have absolutely no right at all. we're not superior, we're different. obviously both cultues have flaws. the islam extremists treatment of women being a scathingly obvious example, but the west is no where no perfect. We've seen what happens when the west try to impose its way of life on other cultures (Iraq, Afghanistan?)

I think this law is disgusting, but i highly doubt its representative of the majority of the islam community.

all i was stating was that ethnocentrism is bullshit.

but, in regards to believing in cultural relativism. in order to award every individual rights i believe there has to be a certain degree of cultural relativism, if not what of the people seen to be part of an inferior culture?

there are levels of cultural relativism, but i can maintain that cultures are diverse and have relative views on morality etc and that these views are influenced by culture while still believing in human rights. these ubiquitous rights are enforced through law and don't impose on culture or cultural standards.

there is no way that men starving their wives for not being sexually obedient is enshrined in islam,and even if it were it would not be excusable. its blatant discriminatory and utterly barbaric.

 

[Planck]

i was completely unaware you posted something at that point.
i'll reply when i'm not full of sleeping pills. you've missed my point.

You didn't have a point other than making it painfully obvious how disconnected from reality you are.

 

[ashie0]

edited.

 

[ImVrySmrt]

[youtube]uYWg3zSXiBw[/youtube]

despite it being too long, that was pretty good.

btw I do not understand how you can say one culture is better than another, if we are to prove anything it must be done via science, scientifically the amount of variables are impossible to control for anything to be conclusive. If the hatred to the west by sub cultures in the middle east weren't present well maybe. The point is it is possible to compare a country to another, but say from external factors such as for example africa, which unlike Australia, the US, or any major developed country by chance is given no commodity rescourse. well of course it's always going to be behind, then there are other factors such as colonisation, and the way the Global economy is designed to invest in only developed nations, well then all indicators are gonna be bad.

face it it's imposible, and in any case is it really productive imposing a western culture on others, they have been within a certian culture for hundreds of years, e.g. if I told Australia to say no drink no more alcohol cause logically it's consumption makes no sense as it provides no physical benifit but creates social problems for some, well of course people are gonna react, it's been their culture for too long, even if there are rational explainations to why they should not do it (this is just an example I made up on the spot don't crucify me, i am not attacking anyone with this example).

Further western culture itself is not flawless, even Amnesty United came out and dared anyone to name any nation not in violation of a human right, no nation exsits, face it humans are flawed. We need to not attack culture that will not work, I am not exactly sure how to deal with this problem, but I know attacking will only cause disdain, then no one wins. I was thinking lead by example but then what about the mean time? I guess some sort of subtle pressure? any ideas?
Obama will save us all (jokes)

PS. umm how is this light and off beat news....

 

[Azarnakumar]

Ashie - please stop posting your vapid dribble it is becoming quite intolerable.

ImVrySmrt - lol mods

 

[banco55]

despite it being too long, that was pretty good.

btw I do not understand how you can say one culture is better than another, if we are to prove anything it must be done via science, scientifically the amount of variables are impossible to control for anything to be conclusive. If the hatred to the west by sub cultures in the middle east weren't present well maybe. The point is it is possible to compare a country to another, but say from external factors such as for example africa, which unlike Australia, the US, or any major developed country by chance is given no commodity rescourse. well of course it's always going to be behind, then there are other factors such as colonisation, and the way the Global economy is designed to invest in only developed nations, well then all indicators are gonna be bad.


PS. umm how is this light and off beat news....

What rubbish. That's like saying you can't say one political system is better than another.

 

[Tangent]

How the heck did this thread get put in 'light and offbeat'?? That is really sad, and i think that the national outcry is just. The fact that the Afgan parliament had to pass this 'quitely' is proof of what they knew would have huge outcry from foreign nations. It just sounds like the man dominated society trying to make sure they get some when they come home. It is sick, women aren't play things, if they are that desperate they can masterbate

 

[Kwayera]

Light and offbeat is a misnomer. This is mostly a forum for individual pieces of news, rather that overriding "issues". If this thread was about treatment of women under Islam in general, it'd be in NCAP.