Islam Discussion (3 Viewers)

[withoutaface]

who cares anyways man?
why is it so important to guide peopel down the path of "no God"
why cant we just believe in God and follow islam in peace?
as we already are..
why does it botehr you and otehrs so much that we have islamic faith..and i am living my life normally ..just like you live yours
(with the exception of a few minor rules )..im not hurting anyone..im not a terrorist..im not opressed..i dont try and convert people..or brainwash anyone..
and if you think islam is all about war jihad opression etc etc..then so be it..believe what you want
just leave me alone..kthanxbi

Because religion kills people.

 

[soha]

Because religion kills people.

um..no..i am still alive..i havent killed anyone
fanatical extremist people who live and breathe religon..they kill people for the sake of religon...and islam or christianity or judiasm arent fanatical extremist fundamental religons...some PEOPLE are..not the religons themselves
but for every day normal people religon gets us through life

 

[walrusbear]

There is no solid evidence, it's called a hypothetical.

However I can show you that it is more likely that there is no God than that there is one:

Argument 1:

Major premise: Occam's Razor; as assumptions increase, the likelyhood of an argument being correct decreases.

Minor premise: Religion makes more assumptions than atheism (it assumes that God exists, as well as certain characteristics about him).

Conclusion: Hence religion is probably incorrect.

Argument 2:

Major premise 1: Theories with more evidence are more likely correct than those with less evidence.
Major premise 2: Evolution is irreconcilable with the existence of a God (as if he is not the creator, then what is he?).

Minor premise: Evolution has more evidence than creationism.

Conclusion: Hence evolution is more likely correct, and hence it is likely there is no God.

none of those arguments really make any sense
for starters evolution and religion isn't mutually exclusive, barring hardlined fundamentalists
these are kinda vague attempts to use logic to disprove the existence of a god, but really it's just trite. beliefs such as these are largely intuitive and don't really suffer under a removed logic.

 

[walrusbear]

Because religion kills people.

i'd say it's fundamentalists and idiots who kill under the misguided direction of religion.
that said, religious organisations have done a large amount of good also
much like anyone or anything else in the world

 

[withoutaface]

none of those arguments really make any sense
for starters evolution and religion isn't mutually exclusive, barring hardlined fundamentalists
these are kinda vague attempts to use logic to disprove the existence of a god, but really it's just trite. beliefs such as these are largely intuitive and don't really suffer under a removed logic.

If God did not create life (as creationism purports), what exactly did he do? Is he just some vetigial entity?

 

[withoutaface]

i'd say it's fundamentalists and idiots who kill under the misguided direction of religion.
that said, religious organisations have done a large amount of good also
much like anyone or anything else in the world

Would this sense of compassion exist in those who are religious now still exist if they were irreligious? I think yes.

 

[walrusbear]

If God did not create life (as creationism purports), what exactly did he do? Is he just some vetigial entity?

it's not really as black and white as that
you can't conflate religion and creationism, as the latter is a fundamentalist stance
is 'he' a vestigial entity?
there are shiteloads of ways of looking at God. perhaps God just IS, alongside everything else.
fucked if i know, the whole point of this is to point out that this hardlined logic gets you nowhere in this sort of argument, unless you're arguing with fundamentalists.
religious beliefs for most others are more fluid and intuitive, and exist alongside everything else.

 

[walrusbear]

Would this sense of compassion exist in those who are religious now still exist if they were irreligious? I think yes.

that statement doesn't really relate to what i was saying??

compassion exists everywhere; inside and outside of religious persuasion. i never purported otherwise
what i'm saying is that religious institutions are responsible for a lot of good work in the world, and a lot of bad. i'm suggesting this is the case for pretty much everything.
i was earlier just pointing out how silly it is to assert that 'religions kill' or whatever you said.

 

[SashatheMan]

i have prepared a little collection of verses that shows islam is a religion of peace. All of them taken from the Quran.

2:6 As for the Disbelievers, Whether thou warn them or thou warn them not it is all one for them; they believe not.
2:7 Allah hath sealed their hearing and their hearts, and on their eyes there is a covering. Theirs will be an awful doom

5:33 The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land. Such will be their degradation in the world, and in the Hereafter theirs will be an awful doom;

5:38 As for the thief, both male and female, cut off their hands. It is the reward of their own deeds, an exemplary punishment from Allah. Allah is Mighty, Wise.

2:191 And slay them[disbelivers ie christians, jews , athiests etc] wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. And fight not with them at the Inviolable Place of Worship until they first attack you there, but if they attack you (there) then slay them. Such is the reward of disbelievers.

2:216 Warfare is ordained for you, though it is hateful unto you; but it may happen that ye hate a thing which is good for you, and it may happen that ye love a thing which is bad for you. Allah knoweth, ye know not.
[War is ordained by Allah, and all Muslims must be willing to fight, whether they like it or not.]

4:91 Ye will find others who desire that they should have security from you, and security from their own folk. So often as they are returned to hostility they are plunged therein. If they keep not aloof from you nor offer you peace nor hold their hands, then take them and kill them wherever ye find them. Against such We have given you clear warrant.
[If the unbelievers do not offer you peace, kill them wherever you find them. Against such you are given clear warrant. That includes alot of people on bos message board]

4:150 Lo! those who disbelieve in Allah and His messengers, and seek to make distinction between Allah and His messengers, and say: We believe in some and disbelieve in others, and seek to choose a way in between;
4:151 Such are disbelievers in truth; and for disbelievers We prepare a shameful doom.
[ You must believe everything Allah and his messengers tell you. Those who don't are disbelievers and will face a painful doom. ]

8:12 When thy Lord inspired the angels, (saying): I am with you. So make those who believe stand firm. I will throw fear into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Then smite the necks and smite of them each finger.
[allah and angels unite to smite disbelievers]

9:73 O Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites! Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end.
[Fight the disbelievers and hypocrites. Be harsh with them. They are all going to hell anyway. ]

22:19 These twain (the believers and the disbelievers) are two opponents who contend concerning their Lord. But as for those who disbelieve, garments of fire will be cut out for them; boiling fluid will be poured down on their heads,
22:20 Whereby that which is in their bellies, and their skins too, will be melted;
22:21 And for them are hooked rods of iron.
22:22 Whenever, in their anguish, they would go forth from thence they are driven back therein and (it is said unto them): Taste the doom of burning.
[Disbelievers will wear garments of fire, boiling fluid will be poured on their heads, their bellies and skin will be melted, they will be tormented with iron hooks, and when they try to escape they will be driven back with the taunt: Taste the doom of burning. ]

10:4 Unto Him is the return of all of you; it is a promise of Allah in truth. Lo! He produceth creation, then reproduceth it, that He may reward those who believe and do good works with equity; while, as for those who disbelieve, theirs will be a boiling drink and painful doom because they disbelieved.
26:213 Therefor invoke not with Allah another god, lest thou be one of the doomed.
[Those who believe in another god are doomed. ]

39:60 And on the Day of Resurrection thou (Muhammad) seest those who lied concerning Allah with their faces blackened. Is not the home of the scorners in hell ?
[Those who lie about Allah will be sent to hell and will have their faces blackened]

40:70 Those who deny the Scripture and that wherewith We send Our messengers. But they will come to know,
40:71 When carcans are about their necks and chains. They are dragged
40:72 Through boiling waters; then they are thrust into the Fire. [Those who deny the Scripture and Allah's messengers will be dragged through boiling water and thrust into the Fire. ]

40:84 Then, when they saw Our doom, they said: We believe in Allah only and reject (all) that we used to associate (with Him).
40:85 But their faith could not avail them when they saw Our doom. This is Allah's law which hath ever taken course for His bondmen. And then the disbelievers will be ruined.
[When they see Allah's doom they will believe in Allah. But their faith will not save them. The disbelievers will be ruined. ]

41:19 And (make mention of) the day when the enemies of Allah are gathered unto the Fire, they are driven on
41:20 Till, when they reach it, their ears and their eyes and their skins testify against them as to what they used to do.
[The enemies of Allah will be gathered into the Fire where their skin, ears, and eyes will testify against them. ]

45:11 This is guidance. And those who disbelieve the revelations of their Lord, for them there is a painful doom of wrath.

47:4 Now when ye meet in battle those who disbelieve, then it is smiting of the necks .......

68:15 That, when Our revelations are recited to him, he saith: mere fables of the men of old.
68:16 We shall brand him on the nose.
[Those who consider the Quran to be "mere fables" will be branded on the nose. ]

Islam - Religion of pe...........War

 

[soha]

no sasha
its not..
for if it were..
i would have put a jihad on you by now

 

[SashatheMan]

Shhhhhh...!
there there..silence child

go torment another religon
we are quite happy with our one and no matter what you say ..how ever many points you bring up..infact dedicate your life to doing so
write a book
start lectures
etc..i support you
but for now
silence

shut the fuck up you concubine.

look i am showing islam people who who makes claims that thier religion is peaceful and the best , to open up trheir minds and stop engoring whats happeniing in the real word from people who interpret it.

if you have nothing to contribute then fuking stop posting .

 

[SashatheMan]

no sasha
its not..
for if it were..
i would have put a jihad on you by now

you cant put a johad on me , even if you tried.

 

[soha]

you cant put a johad on me , even if you tried.

i wouldnt waste my time
you'll see
on the day of judgement lool
sasha im not even going to botehr reading your shit
ive read it all before..i knwo exactly what you mean and what you are tryign to say
and u are mistaken
that is all
i knwo exactly what context those quaranic verses are meaning
you dont
therefore you understand it differently...
your a fucking dickhead..you think that 1.5 billion people are misguided poor unfortunate sould who follow a religon of war?
fuck ..im over it
i give up..its like arguing with fools..you dont get anywhere..because they will alwyas win...(FOOL)...

 

[soha]

THAT IS ALL
...and spare me your bullshit
please..actually no
its ok..i encourage you to write a book ...so please continue to do what you do best
understand islam from the surface and not look into the quaranic verses..like an idiot just for the sake of prooving what?
ur idiocy..

 

[SashatheMan]

i wouldnt waste my time
you'll see
on the day of judgement lool
sasha im not even going to botehr reading your shit
ive read it all before..i knwo exactly what you mean and what you are tryign to say
and u are mistaken
that is all
i knwo exactly what context those quaranic verses are meaning
you dont
therefore you understand it differently...
your a fucking dickhead..you think that 1.5 billion people are misguided poor unfortunate sould who follow a religon of war?
fuck ..im over it
i give up..its like arguing with fools..you dont get anywhere..because they will alwyas win...(FOOL)...

Arrogance at its finest.

if yuor over it , dont reply to this thread over and over and over.

once again your using numbers to justify that your right.
well ill point out that theres more christians then muslims, so if numbers mean anything , then your still wrong.

 

[soha]

Arrogance at its finest.

if yuor over it , dont reply to this thread over and over and over.

once again your using numbers to justify that your right.
well ill point out that theres more christians then muslims, so if numbers mean anything , then your still wrong.

no im not using numbers
but the fact that you are telling muslims that their religon is about war and terrorism and opression and showing us faults in our religon
thats like wtf r u stupid?
why the fuck would i be muslim if it was all about that....im telling you its not
and 1.5 billion people dont go around doing all these things...5 % do..
i am just sick to death of ppl telling me what my religon is?
i mean you would assume i know my religon...a bit better then a non muslim does...im not blindly following it..i choose to follow it
i choose to go to islamlic college..etc
yet you continue to preach to me about how there is no God..that islami is about war..that we are opressed etc etc..its like fuck off already...
if you cant see my perspective..then ur just being an absolute prick
which im sure you are reguardless...

and there will be more muslims then christians by 2010...its estimated and i wouldnt be suprised because we are the fastest growing religon in the world at the moment...even after sep 11...explain to me why so many people..infact thousands in australia itself...are accepting islam

it must be because we are a backwards fucked up religon..yes that must be it..

 

[dawma88]

i have prepared a little collection of verses that shows islam is a religion of peace. All of them taken from the Quran.

2:6 As for the Disbelievers, Whether thou warn them or thou warn them not it is all one for them; they believe not.
2:7 Allah hath sealed their hearing and their hearts, and on their eyes there is a covering. Theirs will be an awful doom

5:33 The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off, or will be expelled out of the land. Such will be their degradation in the world, and in the Hereafter theirs will be an awful doom;

5:38 As for the thief, both male and female, cut off their hands. It is the reward of their own deeds, an exemplary punishment from Allah. Allah is Mighty, Wise.

2:191 And slay them[disbelivers ie christians, jews , athiests etc] wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. And fight not with them at the Inviolable Place of Worship until they first attack you there, but if they attack you (there) then slay them. Such is the reward of disbelievers.

2:216 Warfare is ordained for you, though it is hateful unto you; but it may happen that ye hate a thing which is good for you, and it may happen that ye love a thing which is bad for you. Allah knoweth, ye know not.
[War is ordained by Allah, and all Muslims must be willing to fight, whether they like it or not.]

4:91 Ye will find others who desire that they should have security from you, and security from their own folk. So often as they are returned to hostility they are plunged therein. If they keep not aloof from you nor offer you peace nor hold their hands, then take them and kill them wherever ye find them. Against such We have given you clear warrant.
[If the unbelievers do not offer you peace, kill them wherever you find them. Against such you are given clear warrant. That includes alot of people on bos message board]

4:150 Lo! those who disbelieve in Allah and His messengers, and seek to make distinction between Allah and His messengers, and say: We believe in some and disbelieve in others, and seek to choose a way in between;
4:151 Such are disbelievers in truth; and for disbelievers We prepare a shameful doom.
[ You must believe everything Allah and his messengers tell you. Those who don't are disbelievers and will face a painful doom. ]

8:12 When thy Lord inspired the angels, (saying): I am with you. So make those who believe stand firm. I will throw fear into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Then smite the necks and smite of them each finger.
[allah and angels unite to smite disbelievers]

9:73 O Prophet! Strive against the disbelievers and the hypocrites! Be harsh with them. Their ultimate abode is hell, a hapless journey's end.
[Fight the disbelievers and hypocrites. Be harsh with them. They are all going to hell anyway. ]

22:19 These twain (the believers and the disbelievers) are two opponents who contend concerning their Lord. But as for those who disbelieve, garments of fire will be cut out for them; boiling fluid will be poured down on their heads,
22:20 Whereby that which is in their bellies, and their skins too, will be melted;
22:21 And for them are hooked rods of iron.
22:22 Whenever, in their anguish, they would go forth from thence they are driven back therein and (it is said unto them): Taste the doom of burning.
[Disbelievers will wear garments of fire, boiling fluid will be poured on their heads, their bellies and skin will be melted, they will be tormented with iron hooks, and when they try to escape they will be driven back with the taunt: Taste the doom of burning. ]

10:4 Unto Him is the return of all of you; it is a promise of Allah in truth. Lo! He produceth creation, then reproduceth it, that He may reward those who believe and do good works with equity; while, as for those who disbelieve, theirs will be a boiling drink and painful doom because they disbelieved.
26:213 Therefor invoke not with Allah another god, lest thou be one of the doomed.
[Those who believe in another god are doomed. ]

39:60 And on the Day of Resurrection thou (Muhammad) seest those who lied concerning Allah with their faces blackened. Is not the home of the scorners in hell ?
[Those who lie about Allah will be sent to hell and will have their faces blackened]

40:70 Those who deny the Scripture and that wherewith We send Our messengers. But they will come to know,
40:71 When carcans are about their necks and chains. They are dragged
40:72 Through boiling waters; then they are thrust into the Fire. [Those who deny the Scripture and Allah's messengers will be dragged through boiling water and thrust into the Fire. ]

40:84 Then, when they saw Our doom, they said: We believe in Allah only and reject (all) that we used to associate (with Him).
40:85 But their faith could not avail them when they saw Our doom. This is Allah's law which hath ever taken course for His bondmen. And then the disbelievers will be ruined.
[When they see Allah's doom they will believe in Allah. But their faith will not save them. The disbelievers will be ruined. ]

41:19 And (make mention of) the day when the enemies of Allah are gathered unto the Fire, they are driven on
41:20 Till, when they reach it, their ears and their eyes and their skins testify against them as to what they used to do.
[The enemies of Allah will be gathered into the Fire where their skin, ears, and eyes will testify against them. ]

45:11 This is guidance. And those who disbelieve the revelations of their Lord, for them there is a painful doom of wrath.

47:4 Now when ye meet in battle those who disbelieve, then it is smiting of the necks .......

68:15 That, when Our revelations are recited to him, he saith: mere fables of the men of old.
68:16 We shall brand him on the nose.
[Those who consider the Quran to be "mere fables" will be branded on the nose. ]

Islam - Religion of pe...........War

which jewish or christian fundamentalist site did u get that from???

 

[SashatheMan]

which jewish or christian fundamentalist site did u get that from???

i got it from an islamic site. look them up yourself before saying shit.

 

[soha]

i got it from an islamic site. look them up yourself before saying shit.

its still not acceptalel to post like that
u pick and choose verses out of whole chapters
thats silly..u wont understand the story line that way
loser

 

[veterandoggy]

sasha, i hope you realise that the verses that imply peace and good will totally tower over the verses that imply what you see as "verses promoting terrorism"