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Muhammad Cartoon Controversy (2 Viewers)

davin

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

yeah, problem being, i don't think the European countries should start making sacrifices here and give up on the concepts of free speech and marketplace of ideas and all. so i don't see how a resolution will come about at this point, because the demands beign made of Denmark are not reasonable.

thoguh my big surprise....the big culture clash hits and the u.s. is pretty well on the sidelines.
 

physician

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

SashatheMan said:
umm muhammad has been drawn in a decent way before.
Most likely yes, but it probably wasnt made public (or very public rather), many Muslims would have probably 'brushed' it off when they saw it since it didint contain offensive content, but the majority of Muslims would feel offended because it existed.... (but not to such an extent as they are now)... After all u wouldnt be drawing Muhammad (peace be upon him) u'd simply be drawing someone having the physical characteristics of Muhammad (peace be upon him)..(or similar) and labelling him as "Muhammad" ... as u can see almost every picture (the published ones) shows a completely different person but with the same label (i.e Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him))

And just as a note, in my previous post I wasnt dismissing the fact that the way he was depicted was a "Major" part of the problem.

MoonlightSonata: We dont have any picturial images of the Prophet (peace be upon him), and any depiction of his characteristics in "image" form would obviously be inaccurate ... which then leads to them being considered offensive, although probably not 'as' offensive as the recently published pictures (mainly due to the fact that the pictures did add a 'little' too much salt to the allready salty dish)...

Someone could probably come up with an image similar to the appearance of the Prophet (peace be upon him) because some of his physical characteristics are described in the hadith, however, not drawing the Prophet was mainly the result of wanting to keep Islam free of any idolatry or image worshiping, as was done in parts of Arabia and in other cultures and societies, where images of pious and religious figures were often worshiped.
 

davin

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

and if you don't believe mohommad should be drawn...don't draw him or support a company that does. the issue is the attack of freedom involved.

i'd add a question, why isn't the anger directed at people like bin laden who are the ones who are DIRECTLY associating Islam and Mohommad with terrorism. The cartoons are what they are specifically because of the violence. the signs in London saying to behead anyone that criticise islam, and the chants in Sudan for Bin Laden to strike Denmark next. That mentality is why the cartoons were drawn in the first place
 
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physician

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

davin said:
yeah, problem being, i don't think the European countries should start making sacrifices here and give up on the concepts of free speech and marketplace of ideas and all. so i don't see how a resolution will come about at this point, because the demands beign made of Denmark are not reasonable.

thoguh my big surprise....the big culture clash hits and the u.s. is pretty well on the sidelines.
Just on the topic of the U.S

The Jordanian King "Malek Abdullah" is a direct decendant of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him)... he visited the United states, giving a speech on the issue to an audience comprised of Christians, Jews, and Muslims (not sure if any one else was present from other religions)... George Bush then got up and spoke, but whilst I admit i did not completely hear what he had to say, he was in a way condemning the drawings

But yeah, the u.s is pirtty much on the sidelines like u said, and I havnt heard much about the issue on Australian TV either.
 

Captain Gh3y

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

volition said:
I can understand if they're upset, but I can't understand why they think this gives them the right to try and take away free speech or go and start threatening people with bombings.
Because they [the mobs of Palestinians] are [metaphorically speaking] like a bunch of over testosterone driven little boys with no discipline, throwing tantrums when something happens that they don't like, and looking for excuses to be violent.
 

physician

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

TerrbleSpellor said:
Why the HELL do you have to say (peace be upon him) after every time you say his name?!
Its and obligation on every Muslim, and also as a form of respect.

We say the same thing when mentioning other Prophets as well, including Moses, Jesus, Abraham and many more (peace be upon them all)
 

davin

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

The U.S. has said that basicly, freedom of speech is important, but it has to be considered if this is inciting stuff and you have to be careful with free speech. Its about the same thing as waht British gov't said.
Frankly, I'm disappointed.
 

MoonlightSonata

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

davin said:
and if you don't believe mohommad should be drawn...don't draw him or support a company that does. the issue is the attack of freedom involved.
Exactly. If you don't want to draw him, then don't. But don't insist that others cease from doing so.
 

mr EaZy

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

"Why the HELL do you have to say (peace be upon him) after every time you say his name?!"

wow! do i detect that a number of athiests are actually trying to understand islam here ? lol

please forgive me- but the last time i came here (2 days ago) it was all "go screw urself!" rhetoric
 

MoonlightSonata

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

physician said:
Its and obligation on every Muslim, and also as a form of respect.

We say the same thing when mentioning other Prophets as well, including Moses, Jesus, Abraham and many more (peace be upon them all)
This is understandable - we do the same thing for many of our respected citizens. For judges we call them "your honour", etc.

Although, we respect them for their contributions to society, not for religious reasons...
 

Generator

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

mr EaZy said:
"Why the HELL do you have to say (peace be upon him) after every time you say his name?!"

wow! do i detect that a number of athiests are actually trying to understand islam here ? lol

please forgive me- but the last time i came here (2 days ago) it was all "go screw urself!" rhetoric
For someone who is meant to be reasonably bright you seem to have a problem when it comes to different notions of belief (or lack thereof).
 

SashatheMan

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

TerrbleSpellor said:
Why the HELL do you have to say (peace be upon him) after every time you say his name?!
they cant physicaly massage his scrotum , to gain favor in heaven , so they do the next best thing, and make repetitive verbal diarrhea about him.
 

SashatheMan

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

New Zealand prints Mohammed cartoons
From: AAP
February 04, 2006
A NEW Zealand newspaper has published controversial cartoons depicting the Islamic prophet Mohammed.

The Dominion Post, a Fairfax-owned Wellington newspaper, published the cartoons today, saying its decision was in the interests of press freedom.
"It's important for our readers to see what the fuss is about and to make up their own minds. Ours is a secular society based on western ideals of tolerance and open debate, even if that may occasionally offend," said Tim Pankhurst, Dominion Post editor and Commonwealth Press Union chairman.


Witness: The cartoons

"We do not wish to be deliberately provocative but neither should we allow ourselves to be intimidated. If we allow Christianity and more particularly the Catholic Church and the Pope to be satirised, and we do, should Islam be treated differently?" he asked. The cartoons depict Mohammed in various poses, including one in which he is wearing a bomb in his turban.


New Zealand Federation of Islamic Associations president Javed Khan said the decision by The Dominion Post to publish the cartoons could have "serious repercussions" for New Zealand's economy.
The federation holds the national contract to certify meat slaughtered to traditional Islamic requirements.

"We won't call for a boycott, and we don't want to see one, but news gets around the world pretty quickly. Muslims will make their own decisions and as you know, they've taken drastic action against Denmark," he told the Dominion Post.

What has been widely described as a new battle in the continuing culture wars between Islam and the secular west began in September when the Danish newspaper Jyllands-Posten commissioned cartoons of Mohammed in a deliberate affirmation of its right to free expression.

The row smouldered for several months before being reignited by re-publication of the drawings in Norway and France, prompting outrage among Muslim faithful, a campaign of consumer boycotts and death threats from militants against nationals of the three countries.

Violence is widely feared in parts of Europe and the Middle East after Muslims around the world expressed fury at the 12 drawings and some religious leaders called for a day of protests against the countries in which they appeared.
hehe . nowe its Australias turn.but that wont happen i dont think
 

firehose

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

I'll let some blogger do the talking here

OUTRAGED MUSLIMS! OH MY!
We wake up this morning to see video on CNN showing rampaging Muslims around the world. In Europe, the Middle East, the Pacific Rim ... Muslim Mobs spreading mayhem. It seems that these mighty mad Muslims are rioting and firing their ever-present AK-47s into the air because of cartoons. Yup ... This latest epidemic of Muslim outrage comes to us because some newspapers in Norway and Denmark published some cartoons depicting Mohammed. In fact, here is one of my favorites:
Admit it, this turban/bomb thing could be the next big fashion hit on the Muslim street!
Muslim outrage huh? OK ... let's do a little historical review. Just some lowlights:
Muslims fly commercial airliners into buildings in New York City. No Muslim outrage.
Muslim officials block the exit where school girls are trying to escape a burning building because their faces were exposed. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims cut off the heads of three teenaged girls on their way to school in Indonesia. A Christian school. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims murder teachers trying to teach Muslim children in Iraq. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims murder over 80 tourists with car bombs outside cafes and hotels in Egypt. No Muslim outrage.
A Muslim attacks a missionary children's school in India. Kills six. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims slaughter hundreds of children and teachers in Beslan, Russia. Muslims shoot children in the back. No Muslim outrage.
Let's go way back. Muslims kidnap and kill athletes at the Munich Summer Olympics. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims fire rocket-propelled grenades into schools full of children in Israel. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims murder more than 50 commuters in attacks on London subways and busses. Over 700 are injured. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims massacre dozens of innocents at a Passover Seder. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims murder innocent vacationers in Bali. No Muslim outrage.
Muslim newspapers publish anti-Semitic cartoons. No Muslim outrage
Muslims are involved, on one side or the other, in almost every one of the 125+ shooting wars around the world. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims beat the charred bodies of Western civilians with their shoes, then hang them from a bridge. No Muslim outrage.
Newspapers in Denmark and Norway publish cartoons depicting Mohammed. Muslims are outraged.
Dead children. Dead tourists. Dead teachers. Dead doctors and nurses. Death, destruction and mayhem around the world at the hands of Muslims .. no Muslim outrage ... but publish a cartoon depicting Mohammed with a bomb in his turban and all hell breaks loose.
Come on, is this really about cartoons? They're rampaging and burning flags. They're looking for Europeans to kidnap. They're threatening innkeepers and generally raising holy Muslim hell not because of any outrage over a cartoon. They're outraged because it is part of the Islamic jihadist culture to be outraged. You don't really need a reason. You just need an excuse. Wandering around, destroying property, murdering children, firing guns into the air and feigning outrage over the slightest perceived insult is to a jihadist what tailgating is to a Steeler's fan.
I know and understand that these bloodthirsty murderers do not represent the majority of the world's Muslims. When, though, do they become outraged? When do they take to the streets to express their outrage at the radicals who are making their religion the object of worldwide hatred and ridicule? Islamic writer Salman Rushdie wrote of these silent Muslims in a New York Times article three years ago. "As their ancient, deeply civilized culture of love, art and philosophical reflection is hijacked by paranoiacs, racists, liars, male supremacists, tyrants, fanatics and violence junkies, why are they not screaming?"
Indeed. Why not?

4. February 2006, 02:54 CET
Taken from here
 

firehose

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

Interesting thing about the New Zealand papers that published the cartoons is that they are owned by Fairfax - which also owns the Sydney Morning Herald, as well as The Age in Melbourne. But yeah, little chance it will get published here as well, considering the death threats and hate mail that will surely follow
 

tempco

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

banco55 said:
Now if the US military follows the Muslims lead they'll go and kidnap some washingon post staffers.
Terrorists will be terrorists. If this so called "Muslims lead" were actually true, John Howard would be dead by now.

blog said:
OUTRAGED MUSLIMS! OH MY!
We wake up this morning to see video on CNN showing rampaging Muslims around the world. In Europe, the Middle East, the Pacific Rim ... Muslim Mobs spreading mayhem. It seems that these mighty mad Muslims are rioting and firing their ever-present AK-47s into the air because of cartoons. Yup ... This latest epidemic of Muslim outrage comes to us because some newspapers in Norway and Denmark published some cartoons depicting Mohammed. In fact, here is one of my favorites:
Admit it, this turban/bomb thing could be the next big fashion hit on the Muslim street!
Muslim outrage huh? OK ... let's do a little historical review. Just some lowlights:
Muslims fly commercial airliners into buildings in New York City. No Muslim outrage.
Haha, stopped right there. If this blogger thinks there wasn't any expression of outrage in the Muslim community in response to 9/11, he/she needs a reality check. :rolleyes:
 

ihavenothing

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Re: Jihad Against Danish Newspaper

I'm sure they will be published in at least one publication over here. If Muslms expect Westerners to obey by their laws and violate secularity they should piss off to an Islamic state.

We don't need another Spanish Inquisition as no religion is more "right" than another, in the end absence of religion seems to wash better than conflicting beliefs (see John Lennon lyric)
 

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