State Ranking (1 Viewer)

[dp624]

This may be true I don't know, but there are a few people who DO score 100% raw, and are of course in the running for state ranks. They don't all get first place.

The entries are still given full marks, but they are judged personally for the purposes of state ranks.



I guess that, unless the people who came first and second got 101/100, they used the panel of judges that my teacher said the responses were brought before. And decided from there.

Sure, those top few all got 100/100 - but in terms of a state rank the HSC judges (note: not markers, judges, though all judges are markers) judged the better response over and above the mark value.

the student I was talking about was Amy Maguire -- she and that other guy both got 100 in terms of raw marks I think. But as it went, the judges decided that one or two entries were better than hers and the other who came equal third.



Not if five or so people get 100/100 raw. This can and does happen.

There needs to be a way to judge; the markers cannot go to internals because of the inconsistent marking scheme across schools.

I'm only saying what happens in Ancient. There are judges there who determine the rankings of the top, high-scoring, 100/100 answers.

Perhaps this is different in Mathematics, but I do doubt it strongly -



Exactly, internals can't be used, raw marks are often equally 100/100... so they have judges to decide on the best answers.

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Ok. Say you top your internals AND the externals. And several people did. THe way I think they would do it is by comparing your mark to the mark of the person placed 2nd at your school. Etc.
If the gap between you and 2nd internal is greater, then you're ranked higher. Methinks

 

[shaon0]

Hahaha, yeah.

Haven't you seen a thread on the exam thoughts forum? Most people thought that this exam was harder. Your non-existent knowledge of 3 unit got pwned by the general consensus from BoS. And please keep your nose out of what you don't know.

Seriously, you pretend that you know more than you know. I have a lot of respect for what Kony has done. However, I don't think he would have got a full mark. It would be stupid to give state ranks on how elegantly you did the exam - wouldn't it be unfair? Mathematics is not supposed to be like that. How can someone judge how elegant it is????

To Patar: Are you sure?

If you ask live.fast who came 3rd for Ancient, he got 100 too....what's wrong witih that?? I don't get it.

Why would it be stupid ranking people based on their working?
Okay, let me give you this proposition.
Both candidates heve equal scores in their mathematics test ie same in every respect excluding working. One guy does a massive amount of working for most of his questions and the other guy does a small amount of working, explains his/hers logic behind their working.
Who do you think should get the higher state rank?

 

[lyounamu]

Why would it be stupid ranking people based on their working?
Okay, let me give you this proposition.
Both candidates heve equal scores in their mathematics test ie same in every respect excluding working. One guy does a massive amount of working for most of his questions and the other guy does a small amount of working, explains his/hers logic behind their working.
Who do you think should get the higher state rank?

wtf?

How can you rank people based on their working out? How do you know which one is better? Do you think mere HSC markers can decently judge which method is better?

According to your stupid example, shouldn't the guy who did the massive guy be given a preference to make up for his effort? HSC is not supposed to test your natural talent. It's supposed to test how well you know your concept. That's why you cannot be tested outside the syllabus.

If you were in the shoes of someone getting lower mark/rank because of working out when working out was perfectly fine and applicable to the question given, wouldn't you feel left out?

In maths, there is no better working out. It's a highly subjective view that people supposedly hold. Short working out is not necessary "better". Sometimes, there is a need for longer response depending on the mark value. If the question was a 5 mark question and if the answer didn't fulfil the requirement even if the answer is right, you cannot get 5 marks.

There is a marking criteria for a reason. And supposedly, if there is best working out, the best working out is the one that fulfils the marking criteria. And if you got 84/84, that means you fulfilled that.

 

[shaon0]

wtf?

How can you rank people based on their working out? How do you know which one is better? Do you think mere HSC markers can decently judge which method is better?

According to your stupid example, shouldn't the guy who did the massive guy be given a preference to make up for his effort? HSC is not supposed to test your natural talent. It's supposed to test how well you know your concept. That's why you cannot be tested outside the syllabus.

If you were in the shoes of someone getting lower mark/rank because of working out when working out was perfectly fine and applicable to the question given, wouldn't you feel left out?

In maths, there is no better working out. It's a highly subjective view that people supposedly hold. Short working out is not necessary "better". Sometimes, there is a need for longer response depending on the mark value. If the question was a 5 mark question and if the answer didn't fulfil the requirement even if the answer is right, you cannot get 5 marks.

There is a marking criteria for a reason. And supposedly, if there is best working out, the best working out is the one that fulfils the marking criteria. And if you got 84/84, that means you fulfilled that.

Okay, go ahead and do your pages and pages of working out.

 

[lyounamu]

Okay, go ahead and do your pages and pages of working out.

That's not what I meant. I am just saying that you cannot be marked high or given a preference because your working out is supposed to be better.

Get off the high horse. You are obviously not the one who is very good at presenting your point. It's full of bullshit with no back-up.

 

[Timothy.Siu]

no offense, but i am starting to dislike shaon0 more and more...

 

[Trebla]

Ok. Say you top your internals AND the externals. And several people did. THe way I think they would do it is by comparing your mark to the mark of the person placed 2nd at your school. Etc.
If the gap between you and 2nd internal is greater, then you're ranked higher. Methinks

I don't think that is the case. If we go by your theory, then those in low ranked schools have an advantage. Take Ruse for example, they have several people bunched up in state ranking position, so the difference between 1st and 2nd in their school is very small. Say another school with one person standing out in the top gets full marks in the external exams. Would this person with equal marks to the Ruse people be favoured over them who are bunched up at the top? I don't think so.

 

[shaon0]

no offense, but i am starting to dislike shaon0 more and more...

I don't really care.

 

[lyounamu]

no offense, but i am starting to dislike shaon0 more and more...

He was never liked anyway due to his desperate effort to show off his non-existent knowledge of maths.

 

[shaon0]

I don't think that is the case. If we go by your theory, then those in low ranked schools have an advantage. Take Ruse for example, they have several people bunched up in state ranking position, so the difference between 1st and 2nd in their school is very small. Say another school with one person standing out in the top gets full marks in the external exams. Would this person with equal marks to the Ruse people be favoured over them who are bunched up at the top? I don't think so.

Thats a good point because people at Ruse are always bunched up at the top by at most 2 marks.

 

[shaon0]

He was never liked anyway due to his desperate effort to show off his non-existent knowledge of maths.

hmmm...

 

[lyounamu]

I don't think that is the case. If we go by your theory, then those in low ranked schools have an advantage. Take Ruse for example, they have several people bunched up in state ranking position, so the difference between 1st and 2nd in their school is very small. Say another school with one person standing out in the top gets full marks in the external exams. Would this person with equal marks to the Ruse people be favoured over them who are bunched up at the top? I don't think so.

Yeah you have a point.

But it's hard to differentiate people when many people supposedly got the same mark. As they said on the statistics archives, in my point of view, what they do is that they rank people based on marks first. Then if they got the same marks, they look into extension subjects to rank people.

 

[dp624]

I don't think that is the case. If we go by your theory, then those in low ranked schools have an advantage. Take Ruse for example, they have several people bunched up in state ranking position, so the difference between 1st and 2nd in their school is very small. Say another school with one person standing out in the top gets full marks in the external exams. Would this person with equal marks to the Ruse people be favoured over them who are bunched up at the top? I don't think so.

Alright, then maybe not. I still think that the 1st and 2nd is compared in some small way. Maybe you're compared to your school cohort? Ie the better the cohort in comparison, the higher you'd be. Maybe... I don't know lawl.
Although to differentiate, i tihnk for 3u, looking at the 4u mark would be good. Do note too that SEVEN people tied 5th last year.


Also can everyone cool down a bit?

 

[shaon0]

Alright, then maybe not. I still think that the 1st and 2nd is compared in some small way. Maybe you're compared to your school cohort? Ie the better the cohort in comparison, the higher you'd be. Maybe... I don't know lawl.
Although to differentiate, i tihnk for 3u, looking at the 4u mark would be good. Do note too that SEVEN people tied 5th last year.


Also can everyone cool down a bit?

wow. I'm calm as can be.

 

[lyounamu]

Alright, then maybe not. I still think that the 1st and 2nd is compared in some small way. Maybe you're compared to your school cohort? Ie the better the cohort in comparison, the higher you'd be. Maybe... I don't know lawl.
Although to differentiate, i tihnk for 3u, looking at the 4u mark would be good. Do note too that SEVEN people tied 5th last year.


Also can everyone cool down a bit?

Hahahaha, yeah.

It's hard to ignore that.

BoS doesn't clearly state how they rank people...how frustrating.

 

[tommykins]

He was never liked anyway due to his desperate effort to show off his non-existent knowledge of maths.

True, shaon0 does try abit...too hard.

 

[dp624]

Also I'd like to note that State Ranks aren't neccessarily based on external marks. Some others and myself have reliable data that first in external exams won't result in first in state, but first overall? An example is Agriculture last year.
Person A got 99/98 = 99
B got 98/98 = 98
C got 97/99 = 98
But they were ranked 1st 2nd 2rd in that way. You can see that C came first in the external exam but they didn't top the state.
However I must note that ABC are all from the same school

 

[Timothy.Siu]

Alright, then maybe not. I still think that the 1st and 2nd is compared in some small way. Maybe you're compared to your school cohort? Ie the better the cohort in comparison, the higher you'd be. Maybe... I don't know lawl.
Although to differentiate, i tihnk for 3u, looking at the 4u mark would be good. Do note too that SEVEN people tied 5th last year.


Also can everyone cool down a bit?

nah that cant be the case as already sed above, it would be unfair to people in public schools as opposed to selective schools,
and yes it is done by extension subjects, but i'm not sure if the 3u is judged by 4u, i know 4u would definitely be judged by 3u

 

[Timothy.Siu]

Also I'd like to note that State Ranks aren't neccessarily based on external marks. Some others and myself have reliable data that first in external exams won't result in first in state, but first overall? An example is Agriculture last year.
Person A got 99/98 = 99
B got 98/98 = 98
C got 97/99 = 98
But they were ranked 1st 2nd 2rd in that way. You can see that C came first in the external exam but they didn't top the state.
However I must note that ABC are all from the same school

yeah, i asked that question a while ago, it makes sure u cant get a state ranking from nowhere i guess, that u actually have to do well all year and deserve it

 

[dp624]

Another tihng is, I don't think 3u is judged from 2u maths, that would be horrible. Most state rankers probably do 4u (or really should have done so lol)